One of the most controversial aspects of Islam is its doctrine of slavery. It incites controversy because slavery in the modern world is clearly considered a contemptible practise. In Islamic doctrine however, it isn’t. For centuries, abolitionist groups from the West and non-Western world lobbied strenuously to see slavery become abolished in Western colonies from Africa to India and beyond. The formal abolishment of slavery in Muslim countries was not enacted in all of Islam’s one thousand three hundred years or so history at the time, until the intervention of the West. Saudi Arabia finally caved in and formally abolished slavery in 1962 only upon continued Western imposition. Although slave trade was banned in Niger by French colonists a century ago, the cultural practice of slave ownership was not banned until recently in 2005! In Islamic culture, Islamic doctrine sanctions a tripartite model of slavery that encompasses Enslavement (domestic and industrial labor), Slave trade and Sex-slavery. Prophet Muhammad himself who didn’t participate in any of these practices prior to taking up his Islamic mission, inaugurated this tripartite model into Islam. He set the template for his followers by selling female slaves off in exchange for weapons and horses, making slaves of common folk whom he captured in warfare, and making a concubine of beautiful widowed Rayhana the same night he murdered her relatives and husband’s entire Banu Qurayza tribe! Prophet Muhammad said that Allah has ‘made war booty legal‘ for the Muslim, and that Muslim men are allowed to do as they please with their female war captives including having sexual relations with them against their will. Islam does not permit men to rape their male captives, but there is absolutely no limit to the number of female sex-slaves a Muslim male is allowed to keep. In obedience to Allah’s set principles in the Quran, many Sultans who ruled over conquered territories had harems bursting with concubines in the thousands. Moulay Ismail had 4,000, Akhbar had 5,000, and the harem of And al-Rahman III (d.961) in Cordoba contained over 6,000 concubines, to name a few. Concubinage was sealed into the DNA of Islamic culture. Prior to these Sultans, leading Muslim men during Muhammad’s time kept numerous sized concubines – women acquired as ‘booty’ from jihadi onslaughts. The Prophet never dissuaded them from such practice. Islam is pretty clear on whether or not slavery is lawful. It is lawful. Islam only forbids the enslavement of born Muslims.

At first blush, Muslim apologists approach the issue of Islamic slavery by saying that Islam never really approved of slavery, that the Prophet temporarily endorsed slavery only because he sought to abolish the contemptuous pre-islamic practise gradually. Thus according to Muslim denialists, Islam regulated slavery which already existed among the jahiliya people, but it did not endorse it. After Britain gained control over India, it took less than a century (1757- 1843 when the Indian Slavery Act V was passed) to ban Islamic slavery there. Islam after having spent centuries conquering infidel lands and enslaving the infidels, never sought to abolish it from there, or anywhere else! Omniscient Allah after having looked into the future, never thought to pre-empt the British Empire and give to Polytheist Indians, a taste of the dignity that comes with freedom from slavery – that man everywhere truly desires. Also, contrary to apologist accounts, historical records show that due to the advent of Islam, slave-trade after a long hiatus, suddenly became introduced to India where although slavery previously existed, chattel slavery didn’t! There was not a single slave market in India pre Islam. Previously wealthy Middle class Hindu, Buddhist and Sikh Natives of the Indian subcontinent who were abducted as war captives during Muslim rulers’ numerous jihad campaigns to expand Islam’s imperial domain, were instantly reduced to slave status and sold at the new slave markets, to common Muslim households  at home and abroad in neighbouring Iraq and Khurasan which were “swelled” with (non-Muslim) slaves. In Africa too, chattel slavery was not the norm until Islam, over the course of centuries, established it. Slavery in  traditional African societies generally took the form of indentured servitude, which is a stark contrast to the global enterprise ran by Arab merchants, that demanded village raids to procure slaves for supply to the Muslim world, where slaves dutifully commenced a new life of service to their Muslim masters who purchased them.

sub-saharan-slaves-3Clearly, the advent of Islam did not regulate slavery, it took slavery to unprecedented heights and made people even more barbaric than they previously may have been. During the Western colonial era, Muslim slave trading routes were interrupted. Many of the previous slave-destined Muslim regions also became Western protectorates thus had to do away with some of the practices they were accustomed to. Slavery, however, exists till this very day in the Islamic Republic of Mauritania. Its indigenous black populace have been specially targeted by the government and prosecuted for their Animist religions. Their indigenous languages have been banned at schools and instead they are mandated to learn the sacred language of the Quran – Arabic. The post-colonial Mauritanian government has allegedly sought to ban slavery, three times now; but banning it is clearly at odds with the Islamic call to adhere to a prophetic tradition that stretches back generations in Mauritania. The cumulative resurgence of Political Islam in Sudan following its independence from Britain in 1956 also saw a resurgence of fresh jihadi zeal and the penchant for enslaving war captives that naturally goes with it. Before the Second Sudanese war, 1.5 million people from the rebellious Animist and Christian south had already been killed. The second civil war began because President Nimeiri sought to expand Islam’s domain by islamising all of multi-cultural Sudan into a single Arabic culture. He declared all of Sudan an “Islamic state”, along with a sharia constitution to impose on all citizens. Naturally, the people of the South who had been fighting to preserve their ancient and more progressive culture for centuries rebelled again. By the end of the Second Sudanese war, a record additional 2 million people were added to the death toll. It trumps the ‘War on Terror’ death toll from Afghanistan and Iraq combined. Many of Sudan’s dead were the courageous resistance groups and freedom fighters of the South. Their women were abducted, raped and sexually enslaved in mass quantities. From the perspective of Islamic law and jihad, these atrocities were lawful. Abducting and purchasing female slaves for sex was a most common motive for the purchase of slaves throughout Islam’s history, as it was crucial to boosting the natural resources (populace, foot soldiers) of the expansionist Islamic Empire. By law, children born to slave mothers while in the Muslim slave master’s house are automatically Muslims. Their mothers are not allowed to indoctrinate or baptise them into any other religions. Thus, Sudan’s non-Muslim southern population were specially selected on a grand scale, for ethnic cleansing and sex slavery: a jihad by-product that dates back to the Prophet’s relationship with the infidels of Arabia. Sinisterly, Islamic leaders in Sudan occasionally justified their atrocities by publicly citing religious texts and the Prophetic traditions.

Then there are Muslim apologists who argue that there is nothing really diabolical about Islam sanctioning slavery if Islam equally mandates that slaves should be treated well. These spectacular apologists argue that slaves were more like servants, and not entities without rights. But a slave is a slave. How does one glorify, justify or even condone slavery by differentiating slaves treated well from slaves not treated well? A slave in Islam is not a servant but a slave – a property owned, which a master moves and does with as he pleases. Islam does not punish a Muslim master for not treating his male slave well.


Islam also does not punish a Muslim master for raping his female sex slave. To the contrary, Islam entitles him the latter right (Islamic sex-slaves are female captives abducted in war and used for co-habitation and procreation, i.e satisfying Muslim men’s sexual needs and swelling the Muslim populace) to the fullest degree. Servants are citizens with full rights in courts, but in Islamic courts a slave cannot under any circumstance bear testimony! A slave also cannot own property and can marry, but only with the master’s consent. A slave is not a servant, a slave is a chattel, the moveable property of the slave owner. It is only 7th CE Islamic benevolence that settles for such a thing as ‘treating slaves well’. It doesn’t require an awful lot of observing ideologies around the world to realise that the rest of the world already moved on from glorifying slavery centuries ago. These spectacular pseudo-benevolent apologists are merely writing their own version of the Quran. A taqiyya version for the unquestioning infidel. A heretic version neither validated by Allah’s own scriptures, the Prophetic traditions, nor the history of the Rightly Guided Caliphs. A deceitful version meant to facilitate a fallacious re-branding of Islam to the non-Muslim world, while simultaneously disarming the non-muslim world in preparation for Islamic conquest.
In 2003, shaming the perfidious apologists, Al Fawzan, a member of the Senior Council of Clerics, Saudi Arabia’s highest religious body and a member of the Council of Religious Edicts and Research, the Imam of Prince Mitaeb Mosque in Riyadh and a professor at Imam Mohamed Bin Saud Islamic University, whose religious teachings instruct millions of Muslims in Saudi Arabia and the Arab world, and Muslims in the non-Muslim world clarified that:  
“Slavery is a part of Islam,”
“Slavery is a part of jihad and jihad will remain as long as there is Islam.”
Muslims who dispute that slavery is lawful in Islam “are ignorant, not scholars.”
“They are merely writers,”… “Whosoever says such a thing is an infidel.” 

In the book ‘Islamic Jihad: A Legacy of Imperialism, Forced Conversion and Slavery’, author M. A. Khan discusses various expressions of Muslim denial about Islamic slavery. He asserts that sex-slavery is fundamentally embedded in Islamic jihad doctrine and deals with the examples set by the prophet himself, which is always the best place to begin when studying Islamic teachings. If Muslims and Western liberals are indeed serious about opposing Western meddling in Muslim affairs, the least they must do is advocate a reformation of Islam so that its doctrine of slavery (which goes hand in hand with Political Islam and jihad) is scrubbed out the Islamic texts, or abrogated with new humane texts. Ideally, Islamic law-ism could be isolated from the rest of Islam, and Political Islam reclassified in the vein of Nazism as a fascist political ideology not a religion. Implementing these measures should not be subject to whether Muslims approve or not, because at the end of the day, Islam’s barbarous slavery doctrine is not directed toward Muslims but toward all non-Muslims and all non born-Muslims. Below is an excerpt from Chapter VII of M. A. Khan’s immaculate scholarly piece.

©2013. Secular African Society. All Rights Reserved.


To most Muslims, the only slave-trade that existed in the world was the trans-Atlantic one, which they are very forthcoming to condemn. To them, the more extensive and barbarous practice of slavery of the Muslim world that continued well into the late twentieth century (indeed, continues today) never existed. This perception amongst them is undoubtedly the result of their ignorance about the history of Islam. Some Muslims—knowledgeable about it, or when presented with undeniable evidence—take recourse of the much familiar denials. They offer two common arguments to counter the undeniable facts about the widespread practice of slavery in the Muslim world. Firstly, slavery is not at all approved in Islam; its practice in the Muslim world resulted from the abuse or disregard of Islam. The second type of response comes from the more knowledgeable Muslims, who—failing to deny the approval of slavery in Islam and its widespread practice in the Muslim world—would agree that slavery was accepted in Islam, albeit reluctantly and on a limited scale, because of its overwhelming practice in Arabia at the time. They then come with a set of Quranic verses and prophetic traditions to claim that ‘Islam actually set the first example for the abolition of slavery.

The first type of response definitely comes from the group of Muslims, the overwhelming majority, who are thoroughly ignorant of the theological content of Islam regarding the sanction of slavery and Prophet Muhammad’s engagement in enslavement, slave-trade and concubinage. The second group, deliberately using deceptive ploys, comes up with a set of arguments from the Quran and the Sunnah, which need addressing here. The commonly cited set of Quranic references are:

  1. Quran 4:36 urges Muslims to show kindness to orphans, parents, travelers and slaves.
  2. Quran 9:60 directs part of obligatory charity toward freeing of slaves.
  3. Quran 24:33 advises owners of well-behaved slaves to set terms for their release in writing.
  4. Quran 5:92 and 18:3 propose freeing of slaves as a means of expiation for sins.
  5. Quran 4:92 states that a Muslim should free a believing slave as expiation for involuntary manslaughter.

Based on such references, Ahmad Alawad Sikainga, Professor of History at the Ohio State University, explains away the Quranic recognition of slavery as ‘broad and general propositions of an ethical nature rather than specific legal formulations.’887 In a similar vein, famous Pakistani scholar and poet Muhammad Iqbal (d. 1938) held slavery in Islam as a benign institution, completely devoid of true servitude. According to him,888

[Prophet Muhammad] declared the principle of equality and though, like every wise reformer, he slightly conceded to the social conditions around him in retaining the name of slavery, he quietly took away the whole institution of slavery. The truth is that the institution of slavery is a mere name in Islam.

Other more emphatic apologists come up with such lofty claims that Islam has clearly and categorically forbidden the primitive practice of capturing a free man, to make him a slave, or to sell him into slavery. They affirm their position by quoting Prophet Muhammad: ‘‘There are three categories of people against whom I shall myself be a plaintiff on the Day of Judgment. Of these three: he, who enslaves a free man, then sells him, and eats this money.’’889 Muslim scholar Syed Ameer Ali (d. 1928), widely read in the West, argued that Muslims should efface the dark page of slavery from the world ‘to show the falseness of the aspersions cast on the memory of the noble Prophet, by proclaiming in explicit terms that slavery is reprobated by their faith and discountenanced by their code.’890 Joining the tune of these Muslim apologists, Lewis argues: ‘The Islamic law and practice, from an early stage, severely restricted the enslavement of free persons… limiting it in effect to the non-Muslims captured or conquered in a war.’891

Those scholars, who claim that Islam categorically forbid the primitive practice of slavery, should pay attention to the words of Allah in Quranic verses 16:71, 16:76 and 30:28, which unequivocally and categorically state the division of human race into masters and slaves as natural, as His grace, and as part of His design. Iqbal and Ali should take note of the fact that Prophet Muhammad had owned no slaves prior to taking up the Islamic mission; and at the time of his death, he owned dozens of slaves and a few concubines, the majority of whom were obtained through brutal raids and attacks on innocent communities. Sikainga should not forget that, in Islamic thought, the Quran is the final words of the Creator of the Universe in all matters; and therefore, whatever the Quran sanctions becomes the eternal law for the Islamic society. This fundamental position of Islam contradicts Sikainga’s assertion that slavery is no “specific legal formulations” in Islam. In reality, slavery in Islam is a fundamental institution, repeatedly reiterated by Allah and widely practiced by Prophet Muhammad, which would stand unaltered until the end of the world. Furthermore, it is equally nonsensical and inexcusable to term the division of fundamentally equal human beings into masters and slaves as a formulation of “ethical nature” as Sikainga puts it. More so is the repeated Quranic sanction of violent enslavement of women for reducing them into sex-slaves.

Gulam Ahmad Parwez (d. 1983), another Muslim scholar and activist of the subcontinent, uses a deceptive ploy of different kind. He argues that ‘those whom your right hand possesses’ in Quran 47:4, referring to slaves, should be read in the past tense; that is, as ‘those whom your right hand possessed.’ This way, he argues, slavery belonged to the past and the Quran closed ‘the door to future slavery.’892 Muslims should probably follow this crooked ploy and read the instructions of the Quran regarding prayers, fasting, pilgrimage and everything else in the past tense and relegate Islam to the dustbin of history.


Prophet Muhammad relocated from Mecca to Medina in 622, when he had only about 200–250 converts: from Mecca and Medina combined. With this small group of followers, he formed a raiding brigand expressly for the purpose of attacking caravans from Mecca to plunder them for booty. As his power grew, he scaled up his adventures by attacking the Pagan, Jewish and Christian communities that came within his reach and power for the purpose of plundering and capture of slaves. After Muhammad’s death in 632, this unconditional war on the infidels continued with greater vigor as Muslim power grew in leaps and bounds. They started undertaking campaigns of massive scales eventually bringing down world’s great powers: Persia, Byzantium and India. They often enslaved in tens to hundreds of thousands in a single campaign, besides putting large numbers of the vanquished non-Muslims to the sword.

At the advent of Islam, Prophet Muhammad’s raiding and warring brigand, consisting of just a few hundred neo-Muslim Bedouins of Arabia, declared an aggressive, unconditional and relentless holy war on the rest of humanity with the intention to subjugate and enslave them. Those like Lewis, who think that Islam “categorically forbade” or “severely restricted” the enslavement of a free man, should realize that Islam called for the unrestrained subjugation and enslavement of all free men and women of the globe at the hands of a few hundred Bedouin Arab raiders and plunderers. The Islamic legislation of enslavement is not of “severely restricted” nature, but of the highest scale imaginable, unprecedented in the history of mankind. The soldiers of Islam have executed this divine command with aplomb; the history of Islam has been the witness to that. By any standard, the sanction of slavery in Islam was the most devastating blow to the spirit and dignity of the free human being.

Humane treatment of slaves in Islam

It is true that Islam urges Muslims to treat slaves humanely. Verses of the Quran listed above encourage Muslims to set slaves free (manumission) for various reasons, including for the redemption of involuntarily killing a Muslim (not an infidel). In Islam, manumission is seen as an act of benevolence or expiation of sins. On the basis of these arguments, apologists of Islam would claim that ‘It is not true to say that Islam instituted, or was responsible for the institution of slavery; it is more correct to say that it was the first religion, which put the first steps necessary for its extinction’ (personal communication). Joining this camp of Muslims, Prof. Jonathan Brockopp of Pensylvania State Univerity writes:

Other cultures limit a master’s right to harm a slave but few exhort masters to treat their slaves kindly, and the placement of slaves in the same category as other weak members of society who deserve protection is unknown outside the Quran. The unique contribution of the Quran, then, is to be found in its emphasis on the place of slaves in society and society’s responsibility toward the slave, perhaps the most progressive legislation on slavery in its time.893

Concerning Islamic injunctions for good treatment of slaves and their manumission, there was nothing new in it. We have noted that, nearly a thousand years before the advent of Islam, Buddha had urged his followers to treat slaves well and not to overwork them. In Athens, the Greek statesman and political reformer Solon (c. 638–558 BCE) had enacted a decree abolishing enslavement for debts, a major cause of enslavement at the time.

The tradition of manumission of slaves existed in Greece about a millennium before the advent of Islam. Inscriptions in stones, belonging to the fourth century BCE and later, document emancipation of slaves in Greece, likely as voluntary acts of masters (predominantly male and also female from the Hellenistic period). To buy their freedom, slaves could either use their savings or take loan from friends or masters.894

The sense justice toward slaves in Greek Society can be guaged from Socrates’ encounter with Euthyphro outside a law-court. Euthyphro’s father had killed one of his slaves (accidentally, probably while discipling him), who had killed another slave. And Euthyphro took his father to court for his crime of killing the slave. On Euthyphro’s way to the court, Socrates stopped him so as to inquire about his motivation or the righteousness that inspired him to prosecute his own father. Euthyphro told Socrates that ‘although his family think it impious for a son to prosecute his father as a murderer, he knows what he is about. His family is ignorant about what is holy, whereas he has ‘an accurate knowledge of all that.’ He therefore had no doubt about the rightness of his action.895 While this case, undoubtedly, was an exception to norm, it nonetheless informs us of the sense of justice toward slaves that had penetraded into the then Greek Society (a housands years before Muhammad)—something impossible even today in any Muslim soceity.

The Islamic exhortation for treating slaves well and for freeing them was thus nothing new. Such benevolent practice existed in Greece nearly a millennium earlier. Solon had even enacted a ban on the major form of enslavement in Athens nearly twelve centuries before the birth of Islam. Neither the practice of emancipation of slaves was absent in Arabia during Muhammad’s life or prior to that; evidence for it comes from the following Islamic text [Bukhari 3:46:715]:

Narrated Hisham: My father told me that Hakim bin Hizam manumitted one-hundred slaves in the pre-Islamic period of ignorance and slaughtered one-hundred camels (and distributed them in charity). When he embraced Islam he again slaughtered one-hundred camels and manumitted one-hundred slaves. Hakim said, ‘I asked Allah’s Apostle, ‘O Allah’s Apostle! What do you think about some good deeds I used to practice in the pre-Islamic period of ignorance (jahiliyah) regarding them as deeds of righteousness?’ Allah’s Apostle said, ‘You have embraced Islam along with all those good deeds you did.’

Good treatment and freeing of slaves definitely existed in the seventh-century Arab society, prior to the founding of Islam. Muhammad himself had freed his only slave Zayd when he was a Pagan, some fifteen years before undertaking the Islamic mission. He even adopted Zayd as his son. These generous and humane gestures of Pagan Muhammad clearly reflected the existing benevolent pre-Islamic tradition and culture of the Arab society. Hence, Islam and Prophet Muhammad added nothing new to the humane aspect of slavery.

Islam aggravated slavery

Islam did not institute slavery, but embraced the age-old practice with open arms and gave it a divine validation to last for the eternity and promoted it to a hitherto unprecedented scale. It is groundless to claim that Islam closed the door to slavery or took the first step toward its abolition. In the Quran, Allah repeatedly gave approval of slavery as part of His divine plan, which must stand until the end of the world. Not only that, Islam aggravated the practice of slavery at its very inception, which worsened further over the centuries. Prophet Muhammad enslaved the children and women of Banu Qurayza, Khaybar and Banu Mustaliq [Bukhari 3:46:717], after slaughtering the men. This ideal protocol of the Prophet became the modus operandi for Muslim warriors through the ages until the West abolished its own engagement in slavery and enforced its ban in the Muslim world—much to the anger, disappointment and even violent opposition of Muslims.

One must take note of the way the Banu Qurayza, Banu Mustaliq and Khaybar Jews were slaughtered and enslaved by the Prophet. Nothing as barbaric and cruel, and on such large-scales, as these took place in the Arabian Peninsula during Muhammad’s life. Islamic history tells us that Muhammad’s father had only one Abyssinian slave-girl, named Barakat. The leading men of Mecca are not recorded to have possessed slaves in their dozens. The Prophet’s first wife Khadijah, despite owning a big business, possessed only one slave, Zayd, whom she presented to Muhammad after their marriage. Muhammad, a Pagan at the time, freed Zayd and adopted him as his son.

During the next fifteen years of his life as a Pagan, Muhammad owned no slave. Over the next twenty-three years of his life as a Muslim and the Prophet of Islam, he accumulated fifty-nine slaves and thirty-eight servants as listed by Ghayasuddin Muhammad Khondmir in Rauzat-us-Safa. Zubair, Muhammad’s close companion, had a massive 1,000 slaves at the time of his death.896

As a Pagan, Muhammad, and also possibly Zubair, owned no slaves. But after embracing the Islamic faith, they amassed slaves in dozens to a thousand. These examples make it clear that, instead of taking any step toward its abolition, the Prophet of Islam and his closest companions themselves had elevated the institution of slavery to a much higher scale, compared to what pre-existed in Arabia. Islam also introduced a most barbaric and cruel means, albeit with divine sanctions, for capturing slaves on a scale not seen in the then Arabia.


Slavery, theologically & historically, an integral part of Islam

Despite widespread denials about the existence of slavery in Islam and the claim that Islam took the first step toward its abolition, slavery is indisputably a divinely sanctioned institution in Islam, which will stand valid until the end of the human race. In Islamic doctrine, slavery is integral in Allah’s eternal plan; it’s a part of His divine grace to humankind. All Schools of Islamic jurisprudence, the Sharia, and the religious doctors of Islam throughout history have unequivocally and proudly accepted and preached slavery as an integral part of Islam. The great Islamic thinker Ibn Khaldun recognized mass enslavement of non-Muslims in gloating religious pride when Muslims had transformed Africa into a slave-hunting and -breeding ground. In practicing slavery, writes Lewis, ‘‘(Muslims) were upholding an institution sanctioned by scripture, law (Sharia), and tradition (Sunnah) and one which in their eyes was necessary to the maintenance of the social structure of Muslim life.’’897 Hughes correctly asserts that in Islam, ‘slavery is interwoven with the Law of marriage, the Law of sale, and the Law of inheritance… And its abolition would strike at the very foundation of the code of Mohammedanism.898

Ibn Khaldun thought the extensive enslavement of Blacks in Africa by Muslims was justified, ‘because they have attributes that are quite similar to dumb animals.899 In the annals of Muslim historians, enslavement in general, especially of the allegedly barbarian Blacks, became a matter of pride. It was also deemed as an act of generosity toward curing them of their barbaric nature and sinful religions by bringing them into the true faith and civilized world of Islam. About this line of thinking of the devout Islamic thinkers, writes Arnold, ‘devout minds have even recognized in enslavement God’s guidance to the true faith…900

The Negroes from the Upper Nile countries were violently enslaved in massive numbers and converted to Islam. They were summarily castrated and transported across great distances; in the course of this, the majority of them (80–90 percent) perished. Of those, transported across the Atlantic to the new world, some 30–50 percent perished ‘in transit to the coast, in confinement awaiting shipment and at sea on the way to Americas.’ The mortality of slaves on board ships in their passage to the New World is estimated at 10 percent.901

This tragic doom of captives of mammoth proportion was also seen as a generosity and ‘God’s grace’ in Islamic mindset of which, writes Arnold, ‘God has visited them in their mishap; they can say ‘it was His grace’, since they are thereby entered into the saving religion.902 Even many religious-minded Western historians, echoed this tune of Muslim thinkers about the massive enterprise of enslavement of Blacks in Africa. Bernard Lewis summarizes the general sentiment in this regard as thus: ‘…slavery is a divine boon to mankind, by means of which pagan and barbarous people are brought to Islam and civilization… Slavery in the East has an elevating influence over thousands of human beings, and but for it hundreds of thousands of souls must pass their existence in this world as wild savages, little better than animals; it, at least, makes men of them, useful men too…903

This divine justification, indeed inspiration, for the enslavement of Blacks was so strong amongst Muslims in Africa that they had ‘given up wholly to the pursuit of commerce or to slave hunting’; and as a result, they were hated and feared by the people as slave-dealers, notes Arnold.904 Sultan Moulay Ismail (d. 1727), as noted already, had slave-breeding nurseries in Morocco. In the Sudan region of Africa, there were firms that specialized in the breeding of Black slaves for sale like cattle and sheep even in the nineteenth century. Hudud al-Alam—a Persian geographical manuscript written in 982 for the Ghaurivid ruler Abu al- Harith Muhammad ibn Ahmad, records of the Sudan that, ‘no region is more populated than this. The merchants steal the children there and take them away. They castrate them and take them to Egypt, where they sell them.’ Slavery reached such a level that ‘Among them there are people who steal each others children to sell them to the merchants when they come,’ adds the document.905

Muslims had integrated the institution of slavery into the African society so thoroughly that when the Europeans, particularly their missionaries, tried to liberate them, the slaves felt it preferable to remain under their masters than embrace the challenging free life of taking their destiny into their own hands. A report on the first three years of British administration in Central Africa noted that slave-trade stood as ‘‘a rival kind of civilization to that of white man which it is of a much easier notion for the Negro mind to accept.’906 Enslavement became so widespread in Africa that as ‘Africa became almost synonymous with slavery, the world forgot the eagerness with which the Tartars and other Black Sea peoples had sold millions of Ukrainians, Georgians, Circassians, Armenians, Bulgarians, Slavs, and Turks,’ laments BD Davis.907 The most precious commodity that Muslim traders brought from the trading centre of Volga in the tenth century was white slaves, normally sold by the Vikings.


Possibly the most devastating aspect of Islamic slavery was the castration of male captives. The majority of the enslaved African males were emasculated before selling them in the Muslim world. In India, we have noted of large-scale castration of male captives from the beginning to the end of the Islamic rule. Even top generals, namely Malik Kafur and Khusrau Khan, were castrated, which suggest that the castration of male captives was widespread in India, too. There was also widespread castration of European slaves.

The worst casualty of castration was obviously the robbing of man’s most fundamental identity and treasure—his manhood, which he is born with. The greatest tragedy of castration was, however, the massive mortality in the operation. According to Koenraad Elst, ‘Islamic civilization did indeed practice castration of slaves on an unprecedented scale. Several cities in Africa were real factories of eunuchs; they were an expensive commodity as only 25 percent of the victims survived the operation.908 Furthermore, a large number of captives perished during their passages to markets of the Muslim world, often thousands of miles away; this constituted another huge tragedy of Islamic slavery. The casualties in the raids for harvesting slaves could also be enormous. In Central Africa, recorded Commander VL Cameron, Islamic slave-raiders left the trails of

burnt villages, of slaughter and the devastation of crops. The loss of life caused by these raids must have been enormous, though it is of course impossible to give any exact figures. Burton, a British explorer, estimated that in order to capture fifty-five women, the merchandise of one of the caravan he observed, at least ten villages had been destroyed, each having a population between one and two hundred souls. The greater part of these were exterminated or died of starvation.909

On the magnitude of the mortality of slaves, writes Segal,

‘The arithmetic of the Islamic black slave trade must also not ignore the lives of those men, women and children taken or lost during the procurement, storage and transport. One late nineteenth century writer held that the sale of a single captive for slavery might represent a loss of ten in the population—from defenders killed in attacks on villages, the deaths of women and children from related famine and the loss of children, the old and the sick, unable to keep up with their captors or killed along the way in hostile encounters, or dying of sheer misery.’910

Segal collates a number of incidents of slaves being perished in their transportation.911 Screen Shot 2013-08-10 at 1.17.42 AMExplorer Heinrich Barth recorded that a slave caravan of his friend Bashir, wazir of Bornu, on the way to Mecca during pilgrimage season lost forty slaves in the course of a single night, killed by severe cold in the mountain. One British explorer came across over 100 human skeletons from a slave caravan en route to Tripoli. The British explorer Richard Lander came across a group of thirty slaves in West Africa, all of them stricken with smallpox, all bound neck to neck with twisted strips of bullock hide. One caravan from the East African coast with 3,000 slaves lost two-thirds of its number from starvation, disease and murder. In the Nubian Desert, one slave caravan of 2,000 slaves literally vanished as every slave had died.

Various estimates put the number of black Africans reduced to slavery in the Islamic world from eleven to thirty-two million. Since 80–90 percent of the captives had perished before reaching their destination, it is not difficult to imagine the quantum of human lives lost as a result of the cruel and barbaric institution of Islamic slavery. Ronald Segal, despite being sympathetic to Islam, puts the number of enslaved black Africans at eleven million and admits that well over thirty million of people might have died at the hands of Muslim slave hunters and traders or ended up as slaves in the Muslim world. From the data presented so far, the institution of Islamic slavery, undoubtedly, has been one of the greatest tragedies to befall humankind.

For the complete references to the above excerpt, please refer to M. A. Khan’s book: Islamic Jihad: A Legacy of Imperialism, Forced Conversion and Slavery. A free copy is available online.


887. Islam and slavery, Wikipedia,
888. Iqbal M (2002) Islam as a Moral and Political Ideal, in Modernist Islam, 1840-1940: A Sourcebook, C Kurzmaned., Oxford University Press, London, p. 307–8

889. Muhammad S (2004) Social Justice in Islam, Anmol Publications Pvt Ltd, New Delhi, p. 40

890. Ali SA (1891) The Life and Teachings of Muhammed, WH Allen, London, p. 380 891. Lal (1994), p. 206

892. Parwez GA (1989) Islam, a Challenge to Religion, Islamic Book Service, New Delhi, p. 345–46

893. Brockopp JE (2005) Slaves and Slavery, in The Encyclopedia of the Qur’ān, McAuliffe JD et al. ed., EJ Brill, Leiden, Vol. 5, p. 56–60.

894. Slavery in Ancient Greece, Wikipedia,

895. Gottlieb, A (2001) Socrates: Philosophy’s Martyr, in The Great Philosopher (Monk R & Raphael F eds.), Phoenix, London, p. 28-29

896. Lal (1994), p. 13

897. Lal (1994), p. 175 898. Hughes, p. 600 899. Lal (1994), p. 80 900. Ibid

901. Curtin, p. 182
902. Arnold TW (1999) The Preaching of Islam, Kitab Bhavan, Delhi, p. 416–17 903. Lal (1994), p. 60
904. Arnold, p. 172–73,345–46

905. Lal (1994), p. 133
906. Gann, p.196
907. Lal (1994), p. 61
908. Elst K (1993) Indigenous Indians: Agastya to Ambedkar, Voice of India, New Delhi, p. 375

909. Cameron CVL (1877) Across Africa, Dalty, Isbister & Co., London, Vol. II, p. 137–38 910. Segal, p. 62

911. Ibid, p. 63–64

©2013. Secular African Society. All Rights Reserved.



  1. If ever there was a reason to hate islamists, this is it. The PC brigade would deny it, but I’m prepared to bet that many of the scroungers who claim to be “refugees” when they arrive in the UK, are slave owning.

    • Clearly, the enslavement of infidels is legal in Islam. Perhaps Muslim heretics may find slavery abominable, but there’s no reason to expect a true adherent of Islam to find slavery abominable. Prophet Muhammad himself inaugurated slavery into Islam by enslaving defenceless infidel women and children. Yes, he encouraged Muslims to manumit their slaves, but Muslims are not mandated to do so. If anything, Islam places no limit on the number of sex slaves the Muslim male is allowed from war captives. Secondly, I do imagine though, that it would be difficult for a working class Muslim to keep a slave in the UK. I don’t see how they would get away with it without being noticed by a neighbour at the very least. But if a certain area of the UK, Birmingham for example, was partitioned off and became ‘Muslim zone’, then yes there very well could be slaves held there. It would not be illegal, as Muslims could set up their own sharia courts which would not be binding to Common Law. Further, if the partitioning was preceded by a violent war-like conflict between Muslims and non-Muslims, then there would be even greater chances of infidel war captives held there as slaves. Which leads to the third and most crucial point: Wealthy Middle Class Muslims could easily get away with keeping slaves. There is the harrowing story of a Sudanese girl who was abducted from southern Sudan aged 9, during President Nimeiry’s (offensive jihad) Second Sudanese war, and sold to an elite Arab family in Khartoum as a slave. She got a chance to escape only after she was passed on to a family in London to work as a slave maid. Her name is Mende Nazer It’s a heartbreaking story, but it is proof of the existence of Islamic imperialism and the notable ills that accompany it, such as slavery. The moderate Muslims (Muslim heretics) owe it to themselves and the infidels, to abolish the islamic doctrine regulating slavery.

      • I just want to say that what have you done to stop Hindus who have killed and raped a lot of Muslims women in Kashmir and India , killings of Muslims and rapes done by NATO forces in Afghanistan and Iraq, recent killings of Muslims in Burma where Muslims have burnt alive, illegal capture of Palestine and killings of thousands of Muslims in Gaza.My dear Muslims are not allowed for rapes of any women either infidels or pagans, slavery is allowed but only the war captive soldiers and their allies. The pictures you have posted are wrong this is only propaganda, Islam gives full security to the non-Muslims living in an Islamic states after giving tax to the Government.I am living in Pakistan I know this is the state of Muslims not a pure Islamic Government but you cannot tell me a single case about rape of non-Muslim women here. However America has started a server war against Muslims of the whole world they have killed and raped Muslims, media has proof of my all statements. If you want to solve the issues of Humanity stop propaganda against Islam open your eyes, see the reality and then deliver any thing on Internet If you are real offspring of your own parents.

      • @ Author of this article: Well , slavery is better than “raping and then killing”. Although slavery is not any more a practice among muslims, but when muslim did it or used to do it, non muslims were doing it as well. Similarly , the scripts or material the author have posted here , similar can also be found in Geta and Vedas( Hindu books) and in Talmud (Jewish Manuscript) as well. I am sorry to say that you non-muslim men dont have the courage to give the “other lady” your name, although you visit her frequently, without your wife’s permission. And non-muslim women, although allow their men to got out , have …ex with other women and come back( although unwillingly, and not showing that you even know that, but I know that you know that), but they dont let their men to marry twice so that every woman may have a husband( because there are more women than men).

        @ Shayan: yahan ham Pakistani hi jawab dy rahay hain, baqi k musalman lagta hai soey hoay hain.

      • dear Brother, we are not sleeping we are awake with broad open eyes, there are a lot of Muslims who are answering on this page but useless, infect we are also not here to reply those people who are destroying Islam, we are here to strive and hit kuffr, and Irtidaad out of this world, these seculars are fighting to sustain in this world but we are fighting to make Islam the supreme ruling religion in this world. they are planning and Allah also plans but Allah is the best planner. Allah will destroy them, Insha Allah.
        read Sura-e-Anfaal Ayat 39. Allah has given us a great job to do.

    • Only recently have I become aware of the horror story perpetually perpetrated on humanity by these filthy pigs.
      i can honestly state that I have never hated anyone or anything as much as I now hate mussies.
      We must support Israel as much as possible, they have 4 thousand years experience in dealing with this infectuous desease called islam.

      • Dear sir,
        We Muslims were not there 4 thousand years ago as you know us, even there was no christian only 2 thousand years ago. How come Jews have experience of handling Muslims of 4 thousand years?
        Any by the way , when Christians support Israel for Killing innocent Palestinian children, that may also happen in near future with any body in this world. What will you say then? Specially when a Muslim drone bomb your home when your Children are sleeping and when , next morning, the dead bodies of your children are found from the wreckage of your home, and you see them as if they are sleeping? Will you still act hypocritically?. Then what will you say? I am sure you will grasp your gun and walk towards finding any Muslim to kill, any muslim. That’s what Palestinians are doing in Palestine. I swear to God , I still remember muslims killed by Serbs, Muslim killed by Russians, Muslims killed by USA, Muslim killed by France, muslims killed by Britania, muslims killed by Israel.

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  3. Thanks on your marvelous posting! I certainly enjoyed
    reading it, you’re a great author. I will make sure to bookmark your blog and will eventually come back
    at some point. I want to encourage that you continue your great posts, have a nice morning!

  4. Superb blog you have here but I was wondering if you knew of any discussion boards that cover the same topics discussed here?
    I’d really like to be a part of group where I can get suggestions from other experienced people that share the same
    interest. If you have any recommendations, please let me know.
    Bless you!

    • Hi there! Thank you! There aren’t any boards in the mean time that we feel we can recommend. We know of a few groups out there who are quite thorough in their study of Islam but they seem to lean towards banning Islam altogether which is not really what we are about. We will be on the look out for groups that are quite similar to us in objective and will definitely hook you up! Speak soon!

  5. I’m a Muslim but I might be unaware enough of my own religion or missed something, so why don’t read Koran and tell me where I can find the verses encouraging slavery or the verses revealing that slavery is an integral part of Koran and Sunna. Please read for yourselves and don’t let your ignorance and blind hate mislead you.

    • As a Muslim Hussein (if indeed you truly are), you should be striving to abrogate or wipe out the texts permiting this contemptible practice of slavery. You read an entire article listing Quranic scriptures inaugurating a tripartite model of Enslavement, Slave trade and slave concubinage, and you still ask how slavery is integral to islam? Your expressed sentiments are typical of denialists. Is slavery banned in Islamic jurisprudence or is it merely ‘regulated’?? when the Islamist govt of Sudan justified slavery by saying slavery was a by-product of jihad, did they pull that assertion out of thin air? Do you have any idea just how many children were abducted and sold into slavery in this modern age, right under the nose of vibrant journalism; as a result of this divine mandate that legitimises slavery? Surah 4:24 “Also forbidden for you (for co-habitation) are married women except those who have fallen in your hands as prisoners of war”.

    • Please read our article ‘DENIALS OF ISLAMIC SLAVERY’ again and this time around be more open in spirit. Long gone are the days of Muslims calling their critics “haters”, “blind” and “ignorant”, rather than taking responsibility for their own anti-human beliefs. It’s a new day, Hussein. It’s a new world!

  6. Some think that when Muslims conquered territory, slaves were often taken or that slavery is allowed in Islam.

    When the Quran was revealed, slavery was in wide practice throughout the Arab World, thus, it would have been impractical and detrimental to place an immediate ban on the slave trade, forcing all slaves into unemployment/poverty. The Quran uses a better psychological approach to win people’s hearts in the struggle against slavery and all forms of discrimination by placing a strong emphasis on human dignity and equality and encouraging the freeing of slaves:

    Did we not show him the two paths? He should choose the difficult path. Which one is the difficult path? The freeing of slaves. Feeding, during the time of hardship… [90:10-14]

    Righteousness is not turning your faces towards the east or the west. Righteous are those who believe in God, the Last Day, the angels, the scripture, and the prophets; and they give the money, cheerfully, to the relatives, the orphans, the needy, the traveller, the beggars, and to free the slaves… [2:177]

    The Quran lists the penalty for various misdemeanours as freeing of slaves, see 4:92, 5:89, 58:3. It also implies distribution of community/collective charities would contribute towards freeing of slaves:

    The charities are to go to the poor, and the needy, and those who work to collect them, and those whose hearts have been united, and to free the slaves, and those in debt, and in the cause of God, and the traveller. A duty from God, and God is Knowledgeable, Wise. [9:60]
    The only method mentioned in The Quran for gaining captives (more correctly termed ‘prisoners of war’, not slaves) is during warfare, after which they must be released or ransomed. Keeping them is not an option:

    Therefore, if you encounter those who deny the truth (in warfare), then bring about the captives until when you have subdued/overcome them, then strengthen the bind. Then after either grace/favour or ransom, until the war lays down its burdens. That, and had God willed, surely He would have gained victory Himself from them, but He tests some of you with others. And those who get killed in the cause of God, He will never let their deeds be put to waste. [47:4]

    Interestingly, in the above verse, it implies a preference for taking captives rather than killing the enemy in warfare.

    As can clearly be seen, taking all of the above verses of The Quran into account, it would lead to a gradual reduction in slave numbers and eventually abolish slavery.

    • Britain abolished slavery in India less than a year after initiating colonisation there. Islam did not once seek to abolish slavery on the Indian subcontinent after having colonised the peoples for more than a thousand years. If anything islam introduced slave markets there, barbarising the once highly cultured Polytheists. You are an apologist.

      • Whom you are you trying to cheat ? I lived in India for five years. Cast system is the core of Hinduism. Vulnerable people converted to Islam to get rid of the exploitation and injustice practiced by higher casts against them in the name of the Hindus Goddess. Because in Islam people have equal rights. Good try really I liked it.

      • In India there was slavery system. But Hindus have their version of slavery and that’s called (Caste System). It obliges the lower castes to serve the upper castes. Islam doesn’t recognize Caste System. End of story.

      • Whom you are you trying to cheat ? I lived in India for five years. Caste system is the core of Hinduism. Vulnerable people converted to Islam and Christianity to get rid of the exploitation and injustice practiced by higher castes against them in the name of the Hindus Goddess. Because in Islam and Christianity people have equal rights. Good try really I liked it.

  7. If Muslims failed to understand the true meaning of Islam, then it’s not Islam fault. For example if Christians or Jewish did something wrong (They had slaves too) it doesn’t mean Christianity or Judaism are bad or should be blamed.

    • Christianity and Judaism do not demand or permit the abduction and enslavement (sex slavery, slave trade, domestic and industrial enslavement) of the other. Islam on the other hand does. Any incompatibilities between Judaism/Christianity and a civilised way of life can be, and are, ironed out in Common Law. Islam on the other hand is by divine law, not subject to Common Law. Islam should be blamed for taking pride in its onerousness.

      • Islam neither invented slavery nor demand or permit abduction and enslavement of human beings on the contrary Islam encouraged it followers to free slaves as expatiation for their sins such as breaking fast during Ramadan or dishonoring vows or killing someone by mistake. Islam is the only religion which protected rights of slaves and prisoners of wars.

        A man came to the Prophets and said, “I am ruined!” The Prophet () said, “What is the matter with you?” He said, “I have done a sexual relation with my wife (while fasting) in Ramadan” The Prophet () said to him, “Can you afford to manumit a slave?” He said, “No.” The Prophet () said, “Can you fast for two successive months?” He said, “No.” The Prophet () said, “Can you feed sixty poor persons?” He said, “I have nothing.” Later on an Irq (big basket) containing dates was given to the Prophet, and the Prophet () said (to him), “Take this basket and give it in charity.” The man said, “To poorer people than we? Indeed, there is nobody between its (i.e., Medina’s) two mountains who is poorer than we.” The Prophet then said, “Take it and feed your family with it.”

        The Prophet said : I am the opponent of three on the Day of Resurrection, and if I am someone’s opponent I will defeat him: A man who makes promises in My Name, then proves treacherous; a man who sells a free man and consumes his price; and a man who hires a worker, makes use to him, then does not give him his wages.”

      • Christianity and Judaism absolutely do encourage the abduction and sexual enslavement of women and girls in war–as long as they are virgins. If they aren’t virgins, they are supposed to be killed. Islam is not alone in this.

  8. I would suggest that Hussein studies Islam properly. Sadly, many adherents of Islam have no understanding of Islam! If Islam does not permit slavery, as Hussein claims, then why did the founder of Islam, the Prophet (PBUH) enslave his war captives- women and children? Denialist indeed. I must say, this is a very good article thumbs up!

    • As I said before slavery system existed before Islam. Islam doesn’t forbid it and so other religions. Prisoners of wars including women and children were treated as war spoils during those days, but Islam encouraged its followers to free them . The prophet himself warned Muslims of enslaving free people as I proved before. As everybody knows drinking alcohol is forbidden in Islam, but Allah didn’t forbid it from the beginning, first He asked Muslims not to pray while being drunk, then explained the negative sides of drinking and ultimately forbid it for ever, but still some Muslims drink, because Muslims are human beings too and not angels as some people assumed and expect them to be perfect. Hence, should Muslims understand the true meaning of Islam they would have abolished that inhuman practice longtime ago. Please don’t try to convince me British did it because they are good Christians, as everybody knows it was the Industrial Revolution and economic change only and I’m very confident should oil finish one day and it will within the upcoming 150 years, they will enslave people again.

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  10. I see from the foregoing arguments that Hussein Alsadiq has the usual islamofascist hat on, practicing his taqiyya on us “ignorant infidels”. Notes when he says “read the koran”. His subsequent argument if you dissemble is “read it in the original Arabic”. If you quote from someone who has read the Arabic and still find fault with his terrible death cult, and produce quotes then he will say that you are quoting “out of context”. Something these fanatics also do when out-argued is to point you in another direction like blaming the West for the slave trade omitting to mention that it was isamist traders who kidnapped these people to sell to the traders or, as above, pointing to the Hindu “untouchables” as a way of distracting you from the main argument that slavery is commonplace in the muslim world TODAY despite his lying protestations.

    • Very well stated. As a matter of fact, it was the Muslim raiders already on the continent who supplied the overwhelming multitude of African slaves to Western slave traders. It doesn’t absolve the West from the fact that it was the West who created the Western slave trade, but unlike Westerners, Muslims are never held responsible for Islamic Capitalism. It is worth stating again as already stated in the article, that Western abolishment of slavery gave way to an expansion of the Eastern (Muslim) slave trade. Had the West not imposed a ban on slavery in the heartland of Islam in the 1960s, would slavery by right of international law be illegal in Saudi Arabia today? The simple answer is: no. Is slavery illegal in Islamic jurisprudence, have Muslims taken the initiative (without Western imposition) to see it outlawed there as well? The simple answer is: no, they haven’t.

    • First of all I didn’t call you “infidels” or “ignorant” I just asked you to read the Koran and tell me which verse encourages or promotes slavery as you assumed. Concerning India you are the one who pointed out that slavery had been practiced by Muslims in India until abolished by British, but to your disappointment neither Muslims nor any other people practiced slavery in India, because Indians already had their own equivalent system. Typical Western apologetic attitude, again you blame Muslims for your mess. White people who happened to be Christians abducted around 20 Million black African (most of them were Muslims) from their motherland and brought them to America a fact that you can not deny because it’s documented in Hollywood films. I’m not trying to defend Muslims ugly past, rather I just urge you to differentiate between Islam as a religion and Muslims. Normally Muslims never attribute other people misdeed to their beliefs or religions and you can take the massacres of Muslims in Thailand at the hands of Buddhist monks as a living example personally, I never blame Buddhism or Buddha for these killings.

      • Number 1) Islam encourages and promotes slavery. I already quoted you instances of Muhammad enslaving non-Muslim war booty. Number 2) Majority of slaves kidnapped from Africa during the Trans Atlantic slave trade were supplied by Muslim raiders. So if ‘most of these slaves were Muslims’ as you wrongly assert, then it is Muslims themselves who sold Muslims to slavery (just as occurred during the Second Sudanese War, and as pro-Sunni fatwas in Syria encourage).

      • Number 1) Islam did not encourage or promote slavery ” you failed to quote any verse”. Number 2) Enslaving war captives was an old common practice not invented by Islam ” Prophet Mohammed had no slaves” . Number 3) Concerning abduction of African the whole operation was managed and controlled by Non-Muslims ” White Christians” a fact that everybody knows and very difficult to deny. Number 4) I’m a Sudanese, that’s means you can’t argue with in this matter, it was a war propaganda fabricated by a fanatic anti-Muslims British Baroness COX and Western Media. Sudanese people are very poor to the extend that most of them struggle to feed their own children. Beside that during the civil war majority of South Sudanese refuges “around four millions South Sudanese out of a total population of around 10 million” migrated to the North and not neighboring countries, if your argument is true what on earth enforced them come to the land that would probably enslave them, worth mentioning that the 2nd VP , all Governors of South Sudan States and some Federal Ministers were Southerners. Number 5) Referring to Syria is quite funny, I really appreciate your sense of humor.

      • You’ve already been quoted scriptures, Hussein. In addition to that, this link (which was already in the article) has multiple Hadith and Quranic scriptures encouraging Muslims to enslave infidels. You have all these scriptures yet you ask for more scriptures.
        If indeed you are Sudanese, then you are an embarrassment not just to your Nubian ancestors and to your continent, but to all of humanity. Dismissing criticism of Islamic imperialism as “war propaganda fabricated by fanatic anti-Muslims” is typical Islamic propagandism! One could care less what Baronnes COX thinks of Islam, all we know is Nimeiri with his own mouth said he would declare jihad against the South if they refused his islamist constitution, and he did! 2 mil people died cos he felt it was his birthright to Islamise the entire country. This perverse heinous intolerant and bigoted political trend that occurred in Pakistan and Sudan and is pervasive in Nigeria, Somalia, Arab Africa, Syria and the Levant will no longer be tolerated! Do have a good day, now.

      • Number 1) The different between me and you I’m telling facts while you are overreacting and manipulating things. I know my country better than you. The Civil War in Sudan started in 1955 i.e. before Sudan independence (1956) and during that time British and their laws were prevailing. Numiri signed a Peace Accord with rebels In 1972. In 1982 the Civil War broke again cuz upon recommendations of some leaders from small tribes Numiri divided the South into three states , a decision strongly opposed by Dinka the largest tribe in South Sudan who once again rebelled against the Central Govt. i.e. before Numiri introduced Sharaia (Islamic Law) in 1983.Number 2) We are discussing here slavery and not my personal character. 3) Numiri never said he will declare Jihad on Southerners over Sharia Law. 4) It’s easy to fabricate a Hadith (Prophet sayings) but it’s difficult to fabricate Koran. 5) Your silly tricks doesn’t intimidate me.

      • All muslims are not terrorists…
        But all TERRORISTS are MUSLIMS…
        They are making problems all over the world in the name of religion funded by the gulf countries. Here in india also same thing is happening.

  11. Good post. I learn something new and challenging on sites I stumbleupon everyday.
    It will always be useful to read through content from other authors and use a little something from other sites.

  12. Altho’ I had known much of this beforehand to see it laid out so explicitly and thoughtfully was truly enlightening.

    Kia Kaha, Secular African

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  14. Generally I do not read post on blogs, however I would like to say that this write-up very forced me to take a look at and do so! Your writing taste has been amazed me. Thanks, very great post.

  15. No doubt that the white women is the ” COMMODITY”, traders favourites nowadays. But sir, everybody does that…muslims non muslims, infact russian and Isreali mafias are at the top in traficking and selling women. Who may b a major culpirt in past? Dear sir there are many many great great names you are fogetting while chasing muslims only…. And for sure muslim didnt started all that slavery stuff….. So please try to chase those russian and isreali mafias who are real big brother nowadays. Good luck.

      • You must be mistaken… As far as my knowledge is concern, Islam’s only “TEXT” ( Quraan) does not contain such thing. Hm you may have seen something in “else where”. Sir, it may be the case that someone is quoting something to you, while I will suggest please go understand it, read it full and with context. I know you are amongs those people who dare to speak and I really appreciate people like you. But it really hurts when I see people like you misguigeded or due to any reason in wrong perceptions about right things. At this point you can take me wrong, and I will not mind it. In addition, I will suggest to go and chase the truth and unviel it. Then you will know ” What is what and who is who”. God bless you. You have a warrior + scholar soul.

  16. After reading all these on this day of prophet’s birth day I am further convinced in my belief that ‘Any religion as religion in general has done greatest disservice to human race and brought untold miseries in name of God who never revealed or said any thing it is all human creation to fool prople Hell with the religion let us rise above this scurge inflicting Humanity

  17. Tahir – when did you last read the Qur’an? As you must well know it is there in black and white for all the world to see – even you, tho’ it seems you would prefer to practice taqiya and deny, deny, deny .( And I am a female, by the way). Stop being childish – the grownups are far too educated in Islam to believe what so many of you would prefer us not to know about.

    Nurali – so what you are saying in plain English is that the muslims, because they condone slavery and practice it even to this day, are more religiously inhumane, and allowed to be so, because these practises were preached as mandates from their prophet, than non muslims? Then set into sharia law so that this inhumanity is drilled into muslim children from birth. Down here, we call it child abuse. One only has to look at the adult males it produces to see how damaging Islam is to all who submit or convert. That is obvious to all in their treatment of muslim women, non muslims, differing sects of their own ummah, animals and all whom they and their prophet consider lesser beings. I completely agree with your belief ands find it sad that in this advanced year of 2014 there are still those who believe in such a vengeful and homophobic entity as the one thought up by a Bedouin Arab tribal raider whose only desire was wealth and power. Does not say much for the muslim mindset that they think this is an acceptable belief in this day and age. And even when they know we can see their barbaric practises every day on the news and especially the internet, that they can still defend and more sadly, follow this regressive culture defies belief! Kiha Kaha.

    • Please ask the people quoting Quraan, buy a copy or Quraan translation, and see your self where it is written in black and white. Mam, I really appreciate people like you who have a dare to confront and argue, but it really is hurting to see people like you misguided. I may be a liar, but you go your self to market, buy any copy of Quraan translation and read. and read it with verses before and after the verses in Question. You know what was the first word or Quraan revelation? That is IQRA (in Arabic) which mean “You Read” or simple “Read” in English. Keep your spirit high, and yes keep confronting, one day you will find the truth.

      • I have read many copies of the Qur;an translations – strangely enough the newer editions are sklightly tempered to the classical translations of Picford. Marmaduke Burton et al who were amongst the original translators in the1 9th century.

        We all know a whitewash when we see one – your taqyia is typical but expected. As I remember it was Omar’s choice which was supposed to be the one and only true collection of revelations. Time you guys sorted out your act!

      • “Taqia” is not what every muslim believe in. Only a fraction of muslim( Shia) believe in this thing. I dont. I am plain muslim not shia not sunni etc.
        Secondly translation is translation, and I was not talking about translation but the original text.
        Thirdly please quote those verses or Quraan which include material that supports slavery. Fourthly, we can discuss every aspect in which you have a doubt. Let me know of any other doubt.

        P.S Have you ever thought when in ancient times slavery was so widely accepted and being practiced , how come today people not widely and commonly accept this? Search what was the place from where people started disliking it as common practice. I can tell you many things but it would be better you go search your self. If you need any help I am here, being a muslim its my duty to satisfy questions from anybody who wants to know about Islam or have a doubt about Islam. If something I dont know I will simply say ” Sorry I dont know about this”.

      • Tahir, slavery is no longer widely practiced nor accepted because values around the world today have changed. Sorry to have to remind you again, but the British empire was instrumental to bringing bout this development even though it greatly benefitted from slave trade, just as Khilafa did. The concept of absolute abolishment of slavery never existed in Islam, it is not an Islamic doctrine! Born Muslims may not be enslaved under any circumstance, but kafir captives should. . As Ibn Khaldun put it, slavery in Islam’s history served the benefit of weaning kafir captives from Africa, India, Arabia, Europe for their place in Islamdom. “captives were brought from the House of War to the House of Islam under the rule of slavery, which hides in itself a divine providence; cured by slavery, they enter the Muslim religion with the firm resolve of true believers”

        This practice was never considered abominable, as kafir captives were never seen as equal to Muslims anyway. The concept of equality under human rights values, is not an Islamic one, I’m afraid! Islam was solely responsible for introducing and institutionalising slave markets in India, where such a thing was never once practiced.
        It wasn’t until the ascendency of the West, that room was finally created, which allowed ideas of absolute abolition and equality of humans regardless of religion, to thrive worldwide.

        There is nothing more to research really, to prove otherwise about Islamic slavery. Prophet Muhammad himself was a slave trader. He sold his captive Jewish women to Najd for weapons and horses. He instructed his disciples to amass sex slaves and told them to ejaculate in their slaves. [see sex-slavery in islamic jurisprudence ]. Muhammad may have encouraged manumission and manumitted some slaves himself, but he simultaneously enslaved many more. After his death, his disciples continued where he stopped and enslaved even more as Islam spread.

      • I was laughing while reading the page you gave reference of ” BHRATVANI”. I dont know your gender but let me clear everything in a plain way. Have you ever seen a bomb blast? Its very hard to contain it.
        When war finishes, victorious army(s) does everything and rape is one of the things. What does armies do please these links:

        so how can a handle it? Germans devised a genius solution for that please read this page:

        But Islam does not permits this. Instead, to protect women from war abuse and , a new method was devised. In that , rather than collective rape and abuse ( like Americans did in Baghdad, Afghanistan) woman were given to individuals ( warriors, mujahideen, soldiers) and in those days this was like a normal things in wars. So, afterwards these women become wives of those soldiers.
        So Now I have a question: will you like be raped by 10 soldiers or some time until you are dead( like serbs did with Croatian women in Bosnia) or will you prefer to be a wife or slave of a single man? when there is a high probability that he will marry you.
        If you are a man then for some time consider your self as a woman for my question.

      • In secular democracy, soldiers raping civilians is illegal. U.S soldiers convicted of rape are served life terms.

        The difference with Islam is, mujahideen are NOT punished in Islamic jurisprudence for rape of civilians. In Islam, it is not a crime to ‘claim’ female captives and forcefully have sex with them; but in secular democracy, it is a crime, and soldiers who violate this rule are punished.

        Do you understand this obvious difference between democracy and islamic jurisprudence now?

      • So america is secular? Have you ever heard of the phrase ” In God we trust”? No? Ok sir its written on One dollar US bill. To my knowledge only two countries of the world who can truly claim that they are secular are China and Russia. Conviction? hm, well sir does it solve the problem? no sir not at all. Soldiers do what ever they want to do. You remember that bomb example? you cant contain it… Anyways this not the topic. If you think there is something wrong with Islamic text please quote, or let go this prejudice.

      • Ah – the old refrain. If you do not know the original Arabic one cannot understand the Qur’an. Rubbish. And if you are just a plain old muslim I have every sympathy for you because your brothers in faith are quite adamant that they are following the Prophet’s instructions therefore someone like you (and me) are heretics and destined for death ! I am more than familiar with the verses of the Qur’an (as I am sure you are) that demand the submission of non muslims and death or conversion of pagans so am not falling for that old trick. better things to do with my time, however I wish you well and hope you can find peace of mind whilst still following this deplorable religion of the Prophet. Kia Kaha.

      • Okay. I dont know your faith but mam, you can not understand geeta until you know Sanskirat. Same is true for Talmud and Bibles for respective languages. Have you ever seen videos of German soldiers in good mode( in WWII perspective)? I am sure no. Have you ever seen a vedio of an american soldier raping and looting Germans( in WWII perspective) I am dead sure no. Why not? because media dont want to see it. Americans were heroes even they nuked Japs, And Germans were vilans who saved Europe from Slavery Palestenians are facing nowadays. Dont get thoughts from TV, newspapers or Internet . These three things are just tools. Search for books, people, places. If you will not you will always be at that side of road.

    • and by the way there is only one Quraan….. no version, any where in the world, printed any time in history till now, will contain same words……

      • Unfortunately all these different versions still retain the more appalling aspects of your culture – the supremacy of Islam and the dhimmitude and ethnic cleansing of the Christians /Jews, still being enacted in every modern Islamic country (and non muslims countries too.) You will never be able to justify or sanitise the mandates and laws of your culture to make it acceptable in the modern world. Modern scholars just know too much about its regressive patriarchal tenets both in the Qur’an and ahadith to say nothing about sharia law and the place of women in the hierarchy of this faith. No wonder you do not want the likes of Geert Wilders, Bill Warner and Robert Spencer enlightening the general low info citizens of their respective countries about the aggressive and intolerant aspects of your faith. especially the history of their conquests, still being fought in Thailand and the Philippines to this veyt day. Does it make you feel macho men when you behead littleFilipino schoolgirls on their school busses who are trying to get an education. Is this against your religious principals and your pet hate – gender equality? The reality is that women are at the bottom of the heap and only allowed to exist in order to produce millions more little muslim warriors. So sad.

      • Beheading is bad, no doubt. Have you ever purchased a gun? a bullet? Let me tell you what are the prices of these things. A single bullet costs around $2, an assault rifle costs around $2000 USD. We muslims are astonished that from where these Taliban Alqaida are getting this money?. You think we have not investigated that? You will not believe that most of funds come from some local dealer , direct in contact with american, Indian and some other friendly countries’ NGOs. It may look like absurd but this is true, many “Talibans” we have killed were not even circumcised, had tattos on their bodies and many many other things that directly points towards “Fifth Generation Warfare”.
        Dont get misleaded, dont listen this ” Rupert Murdoch ” media, go outside and search. This internet is just a network of computers, and this is like a small drop of knowledge in an ocean of knowledge. .I may be wrong but not everybody. Search , read, and analyse.

      • well, thats silly question. But a serious answer is : ” Not Indian Tax payer, but perhaps Tax collector”. Anyways, we know the people and we are doing what we need to do.

        P.S Lets not fight over this any more please.

      • and I am sorry if you are an indian, brother its not the common man or general public, its some people in government and some in politics ( and yes some in public) about whom we complain. Anyways, I didnt mean to hurt indian general public.

    • Please confirm all these ” facts” before publishing at your site. And cofirm it from independent sources, and please listen to both sides if you dont have any prejudice against Islam and muslims.

      • I laugh and feel soo relieved when i read what you and other M.I.D (muslims in denial ) have to say,i feel relieved because no longer am i a lemming like yourself who blindly follows other blind lemmings into the abyss.

  18. First of all I would like to say wonderful blog! I had a quick question in which I’d like to ask if you don’t mind.
    I was interested to know how you center yourself and clear your head
    before writing. I’ve had a hard time clearing my thoughts in getting my thoughts out there.
    I do enjoy writing however it just seems like the first 10 to 15 minutes are usually wasted simply
    just trying to figure out how to begin. Any ideas
    or hints? Cheers!

    • Apologies. Not sure why you’re receiving three email notifications for a single comment. How inundating! I’ve had a look at the settings and there doesn’t seem to be anything there that addresses such a problem or explains what I can do from my end to correct it. Do let me know if you’re aware of any changes I can make in the settings to correct it? Again, apologies.

      Many thanks, SecularAfrican.

  19. I am a muslim (just about i would say,dont know how long i could stretch my conscious to still be a muslim though).There was a time once when i was a fanatical believer that desired to see sharia the world over,then one day my wife who was also very religious at the time knocked me off my holy horse when she started getting confused over a lecture she heard from a visiting Saudi scholar about how a Muslim man in honored not just to have four wives but to also have un-limited number of female slaves that he could even have sex with,at the time like any other Muslim in denial i shrugged it off,My wife on the other hand was constantly effected by what she was reading and as time went by her concerns and her gradual disconnection from her female Islamic circles began to have more of an effect on me also.Islam as i soon found out to my shock and as i began to wake out of a state of gross denial in fact encouraged slavery,for crying out loud how is permitting muslim soldiers to take and have sex with women and girls captured in war NOT AN ENCOURAGEMENT,there cannot be any better encouragement than that,and then you can also sell them in slave markets when you bring them back to muslim lands.I am not going to go on and on as i am not much of writing person,but i would like to say this as a just about muslim who is rapidly losing faith in the religion he once loved,in fact no religion seams right to me so if any Christian missionary who might think of wooing me in,please dont waste your time.So i was saying,everything mentioned in this article is the truth and i would say it on my life if it means anything,i knew about these rulings from both the Quran and the Hadith and from the Ijma and Fiqh that i read and heard from muslim scholars of the past and present.present. I am convinced God made man,and i am coming to the conclusion that either man or some other crafty biengs made religion.PEaCe

    • Your wife can bear that you go , in secret, to as much women as you want , which she dont know, but she donot want to let you go some known women? Can you say that you were never been to anyother women then your wife? Dear sir, men are like that, and God knew it and know it, so, by his message Allah contained men’s wild nature into this law. Its your right, your wife is running away from religion becase she dont want you to do this. But if you want to live with one woman, yes you can, its not compulsion. And as you know there are more women then men, so if men will not marry more then one, rest of the women will become public property, and that can be your or mine or anybodys daughter or sister.

      • @ Tahir rana,So you are saying it is fine for a Muslim man to keep slave women for sex and his wife will be ok with that ?.Did God forget that he also gave women as much a desire for sex as men ? and no i do not know that there is more women in the world than men,this most likely is another lie your imam fed you,and why would it be that if women outnumber men that women would become public property ?

      • Yes, as you said men and women have same sexual desire, so what will extra women do? They will look for men like you to satisfy them sir, And btw, you were never a muslim, neither your wife. So dont pretend. You must b a cristian arab, jewish or may b somebody other who have lived in arab areas for long time. And now you are paying back to islam.

      • @Adnan enrique: Yes, as you said men and women have same sexual desire, so what will extra women do? They will look for men like you to satisfy them sir, And btw, you were never a muslim, neither your wife. So dont pretend. You must b a cristian arab, jewish or may b somebody other who have lived in arab areas for long time. And now you are paying back to islam.

    • Adnan,
      The God whom you believe made man has opened your eyes to a lot of things. I pray that He will show you the truth about who Jesus is.

  20. Pingback: Another Monday To Remember To Be Thankful Your Not Standing On A Dropcloth Or Worse | The Warmasters Apprentice Weblog

  21. Trinity is a delusion. Why will God sacrifice his son for the sins of others? Isnt it an injustice?. But we know God is not unjust in any thing. So the hypothesis of Gods Son sacrificial is a total false. Now about trinity, why will God who will never die will have son or daughter(offspring)? Why will God have a wife, and the wife out of humans????? But the truth is, there is one God only, and everything else is God’s creation, be it Jesus, holy Ghost or Virgin Maryam. Have Christians ever asked themselves that If there was only one book revealed on Jesus, why there are many versions of Bible? This shows that you guys are following falsehood .
    The same is true for Jews that Prophet Uzair is just a creation of God, not son, and whole the humanity is chosen not only Jews.
    Same is true for Hindus and Buddhists, that God is one and only, and everything else is Gods creation. Be it Buddha, Krishna, Sain Baba, Hanoman, Shiva whatever. Mahadev, Keep in mind the EESHWER is one and only, no other person shares his power to be another God, or no other person possesses powers to be an opponent or companion of God.
    I am a Muslim and You can e-mail me your questions, suggestions or if even you want to call me names, on :
    I am open for debate any time, any where, anyone……
    Light is everywhere in birds flying, in fish swimming in insects creeping, in child first cry , in deserts dry, in wet lands in deep wells in sky highs…. where ever you see things they are so much coordinated and connected that it becomes clear that there is only one who have created all that. Same God gives good news, bad news news, same God gives rains of blessing and rains of destruction. Same God give earthquake of blessing and earthquake of destruction. Open your eyes that everything is in Gods power…..

  22. Pingback: There's a logical reason why burka and niqab are banned - Page 4 - Religious Education Forum



    A marriage is engaged in by 2 consenting adults.
    Do you really believe a 6 year old child would desire to marry a 51 year old man?
    Do you think that is what she would choose?
    Do you think a 9 year old girl would desire to have sex with a 54 year old?

    The thought of an old man becoming aroused by a child is one of the most disturbing thoughts that makes us cringe as it reminds us of pedophilia and the most despicable people. It is difficult to accept that the “Holy Prophet” of Mecca married Aisha when she was 6-years-old and WANKED BETWEEN HER THIGHS FOR 3 YEARS and consummated/RAPED her when she was 9. He was then, 54 years old.


    Now let us see how thighing is practiced on a female child & who began this evil practice. According to an official Fatwa issued in Saudi Arabia, the prophet Muhammad began to practice thighing his child-bride, Aisha when she was 6 years old until she reached 9 years of age (Fatwa No. 31409). The hadith mentioned the prophet Muhammad started performing literal sex with Aisha ONLY when she reached the age of 9 (Sahih al-Bukhari, book 62, hadith No. 89).

    Muslim scholars collectively agree, a child becomes an adult, available for sexual intercourse as soon as she reaches the age of nine. Likewise, the Shari’a allows any of the faithful to marry a six-year-old child.

    According to the fatwa, the prophet Muhammad could not have sex with his fiancée, Aisha when she was six due to her small size & age. However, the fatwa said that at age six, he would put his penis between her thighs and massage it gently because he did not want to harm her.

    Imagine a man of 51 removing the clothes of a 6-year-old girl and slipping his erect penis between her thighs, rubbing her until he ejaculated and his semen ran down her thighs. To this day, this is considered a benevolent act on the part of the adult male “not wanting to harm her.” What harm could be inflicted upon a young girl mentally and emotionally if not a grown man showing her his penis and stripping her of her clothes and rubbing his male organ between her legs?

    Of course the twisted mind that does such an evil to a female child, would not hesitate to ejaculate on her body. And if this sexually perverted evil frame of mind committed such an act upon a child, the pedophile would not stop at ejaculating on her. His evil desire would go further and rape the child before she was a mature adult. This is exactly what Muhammad did to Aisha when she was yet a child of 9.

    Before she reached puberty, he began to have sex with her. Let us see what the fatwa said about the prophet of Islam and his child-bride, Aisha.”Praise be to Allah and peace be upon the one after whom there is no [further] prophet. After the permanent committee for the scientific research and fatwas (religious decrees) reviewed the question presented to the grand Mufti Abu Abdullah Muhammad Al-Shamari, with reference number 1809 issued on 3/8/1421(Islamic calendar).

    The inquirer asked the following: ‘It has become wide spread these days, and especially during weddings, the habit of mufakhathat of the children (mufakhathat literally translated means “placing between the thighs of children” which means placing the male erected penis between the thighs of a child). What is the opinion of scholars knowing full well that the prophet, the peace and prayers of Allah be upon him, also practiced the “thighing” of Aisha – the mother of believers ?’

    After the committee studied the issue, they gave the following reply: ‘It has not been the practice of the Muslims throughout the centuries to resort to this unlawful practice that has come to our countries from pornographic movies that the kofar (infidels) and enemies of Islam send. As for the Prophet, peace and prayers of Allah be upon him, thighing his fiancée Aisha. She was six years of age and he could not have intercourse with her due to her small age.

    That is why the prophet peace and prayers of Allah be upon him placed his penis between her thighs and massaged it lightly, as the apostle of Allah had control of his penis not like other believers'” (Fatwa No. 31409).

    Thighing of children is practiced in many Arab and Muslim countries, notably in Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Iran, and the Gulf countries. Also evil practices like altamatu’a bil almuka’aba (pleasure from sexual contact with her breasts), altamatu’a bil alsagirah (pleasure from sexual contact with a baby girl), altamatu’a bil alradi’ah, (pleasure from sexual contact with a suckling female infant), (Reported by Baharini Women’s Rights Activist, Ghada Jamshir)


    From the Hadith of Bukhari:

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 229:

    Narrated ‘Aisha:

    I used to wash the traces of Janaba (semen) from the clothes of the Prophet and he used to go for prayers while traces of water were still on it (water spots were still visible).

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 231:

    Narrated Sulaiman bin Yasar:

    I asked ‘Aisha about the clothes soiled with semen. She replied, “I used to wash it off the clothes of Allah’s Apostle and he would go for the prayer while water spots were still visible. ”

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 232:

    Narrated ‘Amr bin Maimun:

    I heard Sulaiman bin Yasar talking about the clothes soiled with semen. He said that ‘Aisha had said, “I used to wash it off the clothes of Allah’s Apostle and he would go for the prayers while water spots were still visible on them.

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 233:

    Narrated ‘Aisha:

    I used to wash the semen off the clothes of the Prophet and even then I used to notice one or more spots on them.

    From the Hadith of Bukhari:

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 229:

    Narrated ‘Aisha:

    I used to wash the traces of Janaba (semen) from the clothes of the Prophet and he used to go for prayers while traces of water were still on it (water spots were still visible).

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 230:

    Narrated ‘Aisha:

    as above (229).

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 231:

    Narrated Sulaiman bin Yasar:

    I asked ‘Aisha about the clothes soiled with semen. She replied, “I used to wash it off the clothes of Allah’s Apostle and he would go for the prayer while water spots were still visible. ”

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 232:

    Narrated ‘Amr bin Maimun:

    I heard Sulaiman bin Yasar talking about the clothes soiled with semen. He said that ‘Aisha had said, “I used to wash it off the clothes of Allah’s Apostle and he would go for the prayers while water spots were still visible on them.

    Volume 1, Book 4, Number 233:

    Narrated ‘Aisha:

    I used to wash the semen off the clothes of the Prophet and even then I used to notice one or more spots on them.
    Sahih al-Bukhari, volume 7, book 62, number 17
    Narrated jabir bin ‘abdullah:
    When I got married, Allah’s apostle said to me, “what type of lady have you married?” I replied, “I have married a matron.” he said, “why, don’t you have a liking for the virgins and for fondling them?” Jabir also said: Allah’s apostle said, “why didn’t you marry a young girl so that you might play with her and she with you?”
    Hence, Muhammad’s comments indicate that his reason for marrying Aisha while a young virgin is so that he could fondle and sexually play with her!
    In the classic history, Sirat Rasul Allah (The Life of Muhammad) by Ibn Ishaq, there is an account in which Muhammad expressed a marital interest in a crawling baby. This event seems to have occurred around the time of the battle of of Badr, when he was about 55 years old. He had married Aisha two years earlier, when he was 53 years of age.
    (Suhayli, ii. 79: in the Riwaya of Yunus i. I. Recorded that the apostle saw her (Ummu’lfadl) when she was a baby crawling before him and said,
    ‘if she grows up and I am still alive I will marry her.’
    but he died before she grew up and sufyan b. Al-aswad b. ‘Abdu’l-asad al-Makhzumi married her and she bore him rizq and lubab… [Ibn Ishaq, The Life of Muhammad, Karachi, p. 311]
    Muhammad saw Um Habiba the daughter of Abbas while she was fatim (age of nursing) and he said, “if she grows up while I am still alive, I will marry her.” (Musnad Ahmad, number 25636)
    Bukhari (6:298) – Muhammad would take a bath with the little Aisha and fondle her.
    Narrated ‘Aisha:
    The prophet and I used to take a bath from a single pot while we were junub. During the menses, he used to order me to put on an izar (dress worn below the waist) and used to fondle me. While in itikaf, he used to bring his head near me and I would wash it while I used to be in my periods (menses).

    Sunaan abu Dawud: book 11, number 2161:
    Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu’minin:
    I and the apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) used to lie in one cloth at night while I was menstruating. If anything from me smeared him, he washed the same place (that was smeared), and did not wash beyond it. If anything from him smeared his clothe, he washed the same place and did not wash beyond that, and prayed with it (i.e. The clothe).

    Bukhari (6:300) – Muhammad’s wives had to be available for the prophet’s fondling even when they were having their menstrual period.
    Bukhari volume 1, book 6, number 299:
    Narrated ‘Abdur-rahman bin al-Aswad:
    …(on the authority of his father) ‘Aisha said: “Whenever Allah’s apostle wanted to fondle anyone of us during her periods (menses), he used to order her to put on an izar and start fondling her.” ‘Aisha added, “None of you could control his sexual desires as the prophet could.”

    Allah promoted this abusive sexual behavior:
    “Your women are a tilth for you (to cultivate) so go to your tilth as ye will” [Koran 2:223]
    Koran (2:223) likens a woman to a field (tilth), to be used by a man as he wills. In this verse, Allah also gives divine sanction for anal sex.
    According to Islam, Muhammad is the perfection of humanity and the prototype of the most wonderful human conduct. He had sex with Aisha at the age of nine, which amounts to rape of a minor. He also left behind an enduring legacy for aged Muslim men to fulfill their carnal desires contrary to natural law and to the life-long devastation of young girls.

    Quran 65.4 “and those of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the ‘iddah (prescribed divorce period), if you have doubts (about their periods), is three months, and for those who have no courses [(i.e. They are still immature) their ‘iddah (prescribed period) is three months likewise, except in case of death] . And for those who are pregnant (whether they are divorced or their husbands are dead), their ‘iddah (prescribed period) is until they deliver (their burdens) (give birth) and whosoever fears Allah and keeps his duty to him, he will make his matter easy for him.”
    Sura (65:4) lays down rules for divorce and sets the prescribed period for divorce. It clearly says, Muslim men can marry (and divorce) little girls who have not yet reached menstruation age. This means that Muslim men were allowed to marry baby girls. This is the eternal word of god. This is an eternal law of Allah. All Muslims must believe in this teaching. Otherwise, they are no longer Muslims but apostates of Islam.

    “All married women (are forbidden unto you) save those (captives) whom your right hands possess.” 4:24
    You can have sex with slaves women captured in war (with whom you may rape or do whatever you like).
    Muhammad established an appalling precedent for abuse of young girls which is continued to be nurtured by the Muslim faithful. For example, Ayatollah Khomeini of Iran gave a fatwa about Quran 65.4:
    “A man can marry a girl younger than nine years of age, even if the girl is still a baby being breastfed. A man, however is prohibited from having intercourse with a girl younger than nine, other sexual acts such as foreplay, rubbing, kissing and sodomy is allowed. A man having intercourse with a girl younger than nine years of age has not committed a crime, but only an infraction, if the girl is not permanently damaged. If the girl, however, is permanently damaged, the man must provide for her all her life. But this girl will not count as one of the man’s four permanent wives. He also is not permitted to marry the girl’s sister.”


    You know how some people insult Muslims by calling them crude names that are the equivalents of sodomites and bestialists (butt- and goat-f**kers)? It turns out at least the sodomite insult is true! We have it straight from the mouth of none other than a Muslim cleric — a London-based Shiite cleric named Yasser Habib.


    by Abu Nuwas:

    O the joy of sodomy!
    So now be sodomites, you Arabs.
    Turn not away from it–
    therein is wondrous pleasure.
    Take some coy lad with kiss-curls
    twisting on his temple
    and ride as he stands like some gazelle
    standing to her mate.
    A lad whom all can see girt with sword
    and belt not like your whore who has
    to go veiled.
    Make for smooth-faced boys and do your
    very best to mount them, for women are
    the mounts of the devils


    Surah 8:69: “But (now) enjoy what ye took in war, lawful and good.” (Yusuf Ali)


    “It may, superficially, appear distasteful to copulate with a woman who is not a man’s legal wife, but once Shariah makes something lawful, we have to accept it as lawful, whether it appeals to our taste, or not; and whether we know its underlying wisdom or not.”


    Satan Attends Every Childbirth; He Touches Every Infant
    Except for Mary and her Son Jesus, all babies cry during their birth, because Satan touches them… (Sahih Bukhari, 4.55.641)
    Whenever a child is born, Satan pricks it; that is why the child cries. Only Mary and Jesus were not pricked by Satan…(Sahih Muslim, 30.5837, 5838)
    Say prayer during sexual intercourse, and Satan will not touch your child…(Sahih Bukhari, 4.54.503


    In a broadcast on the UK’s Fadak TV on May 24, 2012, Habib calmly and dispassionately asserts that all non-Shiite males — especially the Shiites’ Muslim rivals, the Sunnis — are sodomized at birth by the devil, and grow up to become “passive homosexuals”, i.e., the “bottom” of a homosexual pair who is penetrated in anal sex.


    Islamic cleric confirms Muslim men really are sodomites
    You know how some people insult Muslims by calling them crude names that are the equivalents of sodomites and bestialists (butt- and goat-f**kers)? It turns out at least the sodomite insult is true! We have it straight from the mouth of none other than a Muslim cleric — a London-based Shiite cleric named Yasser Habib.
    In a broadcast on the UK’s Fadak TV on May 24, 2012, Habib calmly and dispassionately asserts that all non-Shiite males — especially the Shiites’ Muslim rivals, the Sunnis — are sodomized at birth by the devil, and grow up to become “passive homosexuals”, i.e., the “bottom” of a homosexual pair who is penetrated in anal sex.


    “Anyone who consents to being called ‘Emir of the Believers’ is a passive homosexual. Omar Ibn Al-Khattab, for example, who willingly assumed this title, was, without a doubt, a passive homosexual. The same goes for the caliphs Othman Ibn Affan, Muawiyya, Yazid, and the rules and sultans of the Umayyad and Abbasid dynasties, as well as some of the rulers and sultans of our day and age.

    For example, the king of Morocco bears this title. This is how you know that he is a passive homosexual. This is in addition to the evidence revealed by Western media, which showed that the current king of Morocco is indeed a passive homosexual who belongs to the homosexual community. This was leaked from his palace by his assistants, his servants, and his ‘boys,’ whom he would penetrate and who would penetrate him. They fled to Europe, sought asylum, and exposed all this.

    Cleric Yasser Habib exposes Kalifa Umar as a Sodomite

    It is told (in the hadith) that Umar Ibn Al-Khattab had an anal disease, which could be cured only by semen. One should know that this is a well-known medical condition, which is also mentioned in sacred texts. Someone who, God forbid, has been penetrated in the anus, a worm grows within him, due to the semen discharged in him…
    A disease develops in his anus, and as a result, he cannot calm down, unless. he is penetrated again and again.

    The Shiites are undoubtedly protected from this disease, and from committing this abominable and hideous act. As for the Nasibis (who hated the prophet Muhammad’s family), they are definitely afflicted with this homosexuality.
    One of the devils is present at the birth of every human being. If Allah knows that the newborn is one of our Shiites, He fends off that devil, who cannot harm the newborn. But if the newborn is not one of our Shiites, the devil inserts his index finger into the anus of the newborn, who thus becomes a passive homosexual. If the newborn is not a Shiite, the devil inserts his index finger into this newborn’s anus, and when he grows up, he becomes a passive homosexual.

    If the newborn is a female, the devil inserts his index finger into her vagina, and she becomes a whore. At that moment, the newborn cries loudly, as he comes out of his mother’s womb. Note that some children cry normally at birth, while others cry loudly and incessantly. You should know that this is the work of that devil, according to this narration.”

    Islam is NOT a religion, but an insane political system and sex cult populated by the severely mentally impaired.”

    When cleric Yasser Habib “says ‘passive homosexual’, he is referring to the receptive, submissive, female-equivalent partner. Dominant, inserting male homosexual activity is universally accepted in Islam. He has no problem with that. It’s grown men ‘catching’ that he has a problem with.”

    • For you ,in a western society, a 60 years old man can molest a 10 year old girl, its ok, at the most you call him as molester, ho ha, there he goes on his way to molest another one. Even in some parts of Western Male society, they make a fun of this thing like ” I scored with a 10 years old”. If you search on internet, there are thousands of thousands of such cases , where a man does have sex with a girl as young as 10 years of even less. It is ok for you? But if a man marries the same girl and treat her as her wife with respect then this becomes crime, or it just you enmity towards Islam?

      If you are not still satisfied then visit this page:
      Giving births to bastards. And dont tell me that their ” Sex partners were all under 18, or all that happened under PG.

      Hazrat Muhammad Sallahu Wassallim is a reference for all humanity, he did all things ranging from at least to at most , for us, so that we know the limits of Islam and law that what is permitted and what is not. He also married a woman older than him, he also married women of his same age.
      In your society , man can have sex with many women, but they donot marry them , because they donot want to bear the responsibility of relationship, respect, duty, and honor for women. So man behave like dogs, and they want to turn all women to bitches. For example, what is the ratio of ” Live in relationship ” to marriage in your society nowadays? may it is 100/1. And even that “1” ends up in divorce. But in muslim societies you have to bear responsibility of the women you have sex with, i.e. must marry her, with respect. And in muslim societies this ratio is 0/100.

      So here go you on the path to be a bitch. Other women in your society would certainly vote for Islam.

      • You are such a misleading fool Tahir.

        No woman who knows anything would ever vote for Islam. Across the Muslim world women are campaigning against the literal interpretation and sharia because it is so savagely against women. Girls even get half share in inheritance, and Muhammad even said that women’s minds are deficient (Bukhari).
        Yes, we know you lie about the Koran being the only Islamic book. Certainly it is the most important, but the sira and the hadith are also important Islamic books used to help interpret the Koran. The Koran does not even make a lot of sense without these additional helps to interpretation.
        I’m sure anyone can find numerous other ways in which Islam is misogynistic if they are the least interested, and discover the names of countless women (both Muslim and non-Muslim) campaigning against these things.

        You say that there is only one Koran. Yes, but this was not always the case now was it. There were different versions until Uthman ordered them all collated and any that didn’t fit with his new version were destroyed. There is even much evidence of suras being misremembered and forgotten.

        In a Western society if a 60 year old man molests a 10 year old girl he is vilified and sent to prison where he will be regularly beaten up by his fellow inmates. There is no way he can do this legally, unlike under Islamic law.

        You repeatedly ask for where in the Koran it permits slavery. You are repeatedly given the answers, but then you ignore the answer and then ask again where it says that. What is the point of this behaviour?

        Maybe you could explain to people about the Zenj rebellion. Half a million black slaves revolted (this is just the black slaves that revolted, and just the ones near Basra) against their Muslim masters. Now if there were this many, just near Basra, how many were there in the whole Islamic world? How many people were actually enslaved given that most died before reaching the Islamic world?
        The European slave trade transported about 11 million to the new world (most of whom were actually enslaved by Muslims then traded to Europeans). The numbers involved in the Zenj rebellion indicate that Muslims had probably already enslaved more than this at the time. The Zenj rebellion happened 650 years BEFORE the European slave trade started.
        Of course Muslims didn’t just enslave Africans, they also enslaved Europeans and Indians.

        And what is all this nonsense about having to marry the slave girl that you rape and get pregnant? Are you not aware that Muslim leaders had harems running to many thousand, despite only being allowed 4 wives? This in full accordance with Islamic jurisprudence.

        Whom are you trying to fool here? I have a feeling you are just trying to fool yourself. You cannot possibly think anyone else will believe your revisionist fairy tales.

      • So you think women are not deficient? ok! then why there is a separate team in every sports for women? Why dont women are made chief of army? And You think I am fooling the world?
        Again you didnt quoted a single Hadith or Verse from Quraan that promotes slavery and you think I am fooling the world? You are talking about thin air, unless you quote any thing.
        You talked about Zenj rebellion? 1000 years ago? Well what about current black people protest in USA? Why they are crying in year 2015 the “modern ages”? I am sure blacks are not any more slaves in USA, then why this cries from black community? And you think I am fooling this world?
        Exceptions are there in every time and every community be it a muslim or not. Well, the record of greatest number of wives( or of husbands :)) does not go to muslims!!! Go ahead and search on net. And please dont quote me Saudis having 500 ladies in Harams. It has nothing to do with Islam. I am muslim and I have one wife, and she will remain the only for me till my death no matter what. And you think I am fooling this world.
        You know one thing? You people know that you are wrong. Thats why this world wide war on “terror” is being impose by Europeans and Americans on us. I bet, any body who read Quraan with translation will become muslim. I challenge every body here. Go ahead and read Quraan with translation. But Quraan also says that some people will not, these are those people who Allah dont want to get hidaya or True path due to their bad deeds.

        And in last my world famous sentence” and you thing I am fooling the World”?

      • No Tahir please stop your straw man arguments.
        The quote was that women’s ‘minds’ are deficient. Women’s minds are not deficient. Generally women’s bodies are not as physically strong but women’s minds are clearly not in the least deficient. Sure the military is male dominated but there were successful female military leaders long before Islam. Even devout Muslims who knew Muhammad followed Aisha into battle against Ali.
        Anyway women have been very successful leaders of companies, organisations, and countries. This has even happened in some parts of the Muslim world.

        Women have also been at the forefront of intellectual thought. One woman, Marie Curie, has as many nobel science awards as all Muslims combined (well actually more, one of the Muslims is actually an Ahmadi, so not officially a Muslim in his own country – Pakistan). It is not women’s minds that are deficient.

        Others here have already quoted the Koran and hadith. You have ignored them, but for the sake of completeness, here you are. The Koran accepts slavery rather than actually promoting it, but the hadith (and sira)? Well, Muhammad is the perfect example of course:

        Quran 33:50
        ‘O Prophet! We have made lawful to thee thy wives to whom thou hast paid their dowers; and those (slaves) whom thy right hand possesses out of the prisoners of war whom Allah has assigned to thee’

        Quran 24:32
        ‘And marry those among you who are single and those who are fit among your male slaves and your female slaves…’

        Quran 2:178
        ‘O ye who believe! Retaliation is prescribed for you in the matter of the murdered; the freeman for the freeman, and the slave for the slave, and the female for the female.’

        Quran 16:75
        ‘Allah sets forth the Parable (of two men: one) a slave under the dominion of another; He has no power of any sort; and (the other) a man on whom We have bestowed goodly favours from Ourselves, and he spends thereof (freely), privately and publicly: are the two equal? (By no means;) praise be to Allah.’

        Bukhari 3:41:598 and 3:34:351
        ‘Narrated Jabir: A man manumitted a slave and he had no other property than that, so the Prophet cancelled the manumission (and sold the slave for him). No’aim bin Al-Nahham bought the slave from him.’

        Ishaq 693
        ‘Then the apostle sent for Sa’d bin Zayd al-Ansari brother of bin Abdul-Ashhal with some of the captive women of Banu Qurayza to Najd and he sold them for horses and weapons.’

        Bukhari 3:47:765
        ‘Narrated Kurib: the freed slave of Ibn ‘Abbas, that Maimuna bint Al-Harith told him that she manumitted a slave-girl without taking the permission of the Prophet. On the day when it was her turn to be with the Prophet, she said, “Do you know, O Allah’s Apostle, that I have manumitted my slave-girl?” He said, “Have you really?” She replied in the affirmative. He said, “You would have got more reward if you had given her (i.e. the slave-girl) to one of your maternal uncles.” ‘

        Bukhari 1:8:367
        ‘The Prophet said, ‘Go and take any slave girl.’ He took Safiya bint Huyai. A man came to the Prophet and said, ‘O Allah’s Apostles! You gave Safiya bint Huyai to Dihya and she is the chief mistress of the tribes of Quraiza and An-Nadir and she befits none but you.’ So the Prophet said, ‘Bring him along with her.’ So Dihya came with her and when the Prophet saw her, he said to Dihya, ‘Take any slave girl other than her from the captives.’

        Bukhari 9:91:368
        ‘Narrated ‘Umar: I came and behold, Allah’s Apostle was staying on a Mashroba (attic room) and a black slave of Allah’s Apostle was at the top if its stairs. I said to him, “(Tell the Prophet) that here is ‘Umar bin Al-Khattab (asking for permission to enter).” Then he admitted me.’

        Zad al Ma’ad p160
        ‘Mohammed had many male and female slaves. He used to buy and sell them, but he purchased more slaves than he sold, especially after God empowered him by His message, as well as after his immigration from Mecca. He once sold one black slave for two. His name was Jacob al-Mudbir. His purchases of slaves were more than he sold. He was used to renting out and hiring many slaves, but he hired more slaves than he rented out.’

        ibid p114-116
        ‘These are the names of Muhammad’s male slaves: Yakan Abu Sharh, Aflah, ‘Ubayd, Dhakwan, Tahman, Mirwan, Hunayn, Sanad, Fadala Yamamin, Anjasha al-Hadi, Mad’am, Karkara, Abu Rafi’, Thawban, Ab Kabsha, Salih, Rabah, Yara Nubyan, Fadila, Waqid, Mabur, Abu Waqid, Kasam, Abu ‘Ayb, Abu Muwayhiba, Zayd Ibn Haritha, and also a black slave called Mahran, who was re-named (by Muhammad) Safina (`ship’).’
        ‘Muhammad’s Maid Slaves “are Salma Um Rafi’, Maymuna daughter of Abu Asib, Maymuna daughter of Sa’d, Khadra, Radwa, Razina, Um Damira, Rayhana, Mary the Coptic, in addition to two other maid-slaves, one of them given to him as a present by his cousin, Zaynab, and the other one captured in a war.’

        Bukhari 1:8:440
        ‘Narrated Jabir: A woman said, “O Allah’s Apostle! Shall I get something constructed for you to sit on as I have a slave who is a carpenter?” He replied, “Yes, if you like.” So she had that pulpit constructed.’

        So Muhammad’s own pulpit was constructed by a slave. I’ll leave it at this but I’m sure you are aware I could quote others.

        I think I will leave this point with a quote from a Muslim scholar.
        ‘Slavery is a part of Islam…(those who argue that slavery is abolished are) ignorant, not scholars. They are merely writers. Whoever says such things is an infidel.’
        Sheikh Salah al Fawzan, senior council of clerics

        I only mentioned the Zanj rebellion to show how you are wrong that Islam doesn’t permit and didn’t practice slavery. I only mention the harems to show how Islam does not force you to marry slaves that you have intercourse with. This was not limited to Saudis at all as you imply. Many Muslim rulers in many different places had harems running to thousands. Not just the rulers either.
        You are fooling people because this is part of verifiable Islamic history.
        You are fooling people because Islamic doctrine clearly allows men to have up to four wives and as many concubines as they like.
        It is not hard to find a photograph on the internet of girls celebrating their release from a harem (by the secular Ataturk) as late as 1931.

        I have already read the Koran, most of it more than once, so don’t make that bet about becoming Muslim. Have you read it? You seem rather unclear as to what it contains.

        I would strongly recommend anyone else to read it as well. I would advise reading it in the order that the verses were revealed rather than from front to back. It makes more sense that way.

      • Well in all that, the thing you cant see is the completeness of Islam, it addresses even for problems pertaining to slaves( which is no more an standard Islamic/non-Islamic practice). Actually slavery was not an Islamic thing, it was very common in those day in all societies and regions of world, and all those Hadiths and verses you quoted were to regulate even that slavery thing. So dont try to paint the word “Slavery” on Islam, it was a common practice, but not any more.
        BTW you only saw these verses in Quraan? Nothing else or something telling about the rights of women? That show’s you have a prejudice about Islam, and you had some agenda before touching or opening these books against Islam, actually you were looking for some knowledge that you can use against Islam, so be happy you got them. You will never get the right path until you dont aim to Hidayah or you dont let your prejudice against Islam go.

        Just for once , let your thoughts go, and read Quraan for the seek of knowing what that book says, what is message/command of Allah.

        Read it with clear mind. I dont know you background but it seems either you are an Islamic student or someone standing at your back( or may be something like that).

  24. 1) Kudos to the writers on this website.

    2) Derek, I don’t know why you spend so much time talking to these people. PC brigade too are busy protesting in Mauritania when they should be thanking Allah for his light and enjoying their religiiiiiion of grief

  25. Hi again Tahir,
    You last reply takes a more positive tone than some of your previous ones and I thank you for that. In fact you make me look bad for being a touch insulting.

    You are correct that Islam was part of the Arabic society before Islam. Also Islam does specify some regulation, encourages good treatment of slaves and says that it is morally a good thing to free slaves in certain circumstances.
    However it also specifies that conquered people can be enslaved and that slaves can be purchased and traded. It effectively condones slavery for all time.

    Whilst in theory Islam demands good treatment for slaves, in practice this just doesn’t happen. Almost all male black slaves under Islam were castrated and Islamic law says you can punish your slave in any way you like for any perceived wrongdoing that you ascertain.
    The fact remains that Muslims practiced slavery, on a much larger scale than Westerners, from the start of Islam until very nearly the present day. They were heavily involved even in the Western slave trade. They only stopped slavery because Westerners effectively pressured and shamed them into it. There was no appreciable pressure to stop slavery from inside the Islamic world.
    I don’t paint the word ‘slavery’ on Islam. It is there for all to see in the history books, often based on accounts by Muslims of the time (well the history books based on reality anyway).
    The actual English word slave comes from the race of people the slavs. The Muslims enslaved so many of these people that the name of the race came to be the word for slavery in the English language. The actual word slavery that you don’t want Islam painted with is a direct consequence of the Islamic practice of slavery.
    I know it is not a common practice now and I’m sure most Muslims would be horrified if it were. It does still happen though in some places, it’s not completely gone from all Muslim societies.

    I also agree (with reservations) that Islam was quite forward thinking for the time in specifying protections for women. There weren’t many places (if any) in the 7th century that afforded women anything like the formal rights and protections set out in Islam.

    It obviously wasn’t all bad for women’s rights before Islam though. Muhammad’s first wife was a wealthy and successful businesswoman who felt empowered enough to propose marriage to him.

    It wasn’t all good for women under Islam either. Aisha is recorded as having complained to Muhammad ‘I have not seen any woman suffer as much as the believing women’ after one of her friends received a particularly bad beating from the woman’s husband. Muhammad just told the women to go back to her husband and have sex with him.

    Whilst the rights were quite innovative and commendable for the 7th century they fall far short of modern standards (and standards derived from ethics derived from reason rather than dogma). Again, what started as something positive at that time is now used to guarantee that women are unequally treated and oppressed for all time.

    Of course I am aware of other parts of the Koran but they are not what this discussion was about.

    You have got my motivations for reading the Koran almost exactly opposite to the truth.
    When I decided to read the Koran it was because I was fully expecting to find the much vaunted religion of peace and tolerance. I genuinely believed (and very much hoped) that was what I would find. I was appalled by all the negative things done in Islam’s name, I was appalled by the negativity displayed by non Muslims. I wanted to be able to have the knowledge to show them how wrong they were.
    After some initial confusion I soon decided to read it in the order it was reveled (as implied earlier). At first it was okay. I can’t say I liked the overall message which came across to me just as ‘believe or else’ repeated over and over in different ways. Or ‘believe and be rewarded’, ‘disbelieve and be punished’ if you prefer. Once the Medinan verses got going though I didn’t think it was OK. The punishments for not believing began to be implemented by the followers of Islam rather than being left to Allah.

    I had a reasonably positive view of Islam that I expected to be confirmed by the Koran. I found instead that my view was undermined by it.
    Since then I have studied other hadith and Islamic history to try and get a clearer picture. I feel there must be something I am missing. As I study I often find that the more negative things are being reinforced rather than corrected.
    Of course it is not all bad, there are just bits that are (in my currently held opinion) fundamentally and unavoidably wrong.

    I have tried to gain a more positive message. I am currently in the middle of ‘in the footsteps of the prophet’ by Tariq Ramadan. His picture of Muhammad is worthy and positive. It is also not completely recongnisable to me as the same Muhammad I have read from the other sources. He draws wonderful lessons for life from the most obscure chapters in Muhammad’s life whilst apparently ignoring well documented other things. I find he cherry picks just as much as the most rabid Christian preacher.

    Don’t get me wrong there are things wrong with other ideologies and religions. There is generally a willingness for people to face these problems, be honest about things that went wrong with them historically and maybe adjust them accordingly.
    I’m not sure Muslims are honest enough in this regard.

    I believe Islam needs some reform (or maybe clarification if you prefer) for the modern world. I think the evidence for this is overwhelming. Currently Islam seems to deny this and will do anything it can to avoid it.

    If we accept that slavery should no longer be practised in Islam then are we not accepting that we need some generally accepted clarification of the teachings? If we had it, these idiots in IS would not be able to claim they were being Islamic when they enslaved people. We could solve a lot of the problems in the world if we could agree on this clarification.

    • Well I am amazed that all your that knowledge about Quraan and Hadith is a result of just “self study”.
      See, reform is something we link to man made laws.
      As a matter of fact I have not yet reviewed all references you gave, but I am sure there will be some context behind them , which when explained will remove all your doubts.
      The way you think(write) about things is a secular way of thinking about things. A totally selfish way to think about things. But see, your mom carried you for 9 months selflessly, without asking why to carry another human’s weight for 9 months. But there she thought with her heart, Thank God not with modern human brain. Human brains are not that big to argue the words of almighty. Or you deny Quraan as the words of almighty?
      There is another question. If we bring those “reforms” in Islam, then will you accept Islam to be true , even after knowing that WE ( muslims) brought the changes in Islam, and it is surely not a heavenly thing?
      In Quraan Allah say’s ” they will not be your friends unless you become like them”. Now what you say?

      • Hi again Tahir,
        Thanks for replying again, I’ll try and make my views a bit clearer. I don’t think they are quite as opposed to many Muslims as you may think.

        I’m not that knowledgeable about the Quran and hadith. I have a good overall view I suppose from my own study. But in this day of the internet it is fairly easy to find expert analysis by scholars (and indeed critics) far more qualified than me. I certainly can’t claim to have come up with these verses ‘off the top of my head’.

        I challenge your definition of secular. Secular to me means considering all points of view, however derived. I would say that just limiting yourself to a single religious point of view is actually more selfish.

        I would of course argue that a mother’s willingness to carry a child is an inborn (evolved!) characteristic of her humanity. I think that following a strict dogma that tells us how to behave, rather than being guided by our own humanity is the dangerous thing.
        You can even argue that our humanity must have been put there directly by God if you believe in him, so it should supercede any written thing. You are experiencing his direct will straight to your soul rather than having to risk misinterpreting it through words.

        I would of course deny the words of the Quran as from the almighty. This is a very different discussion though and I would prefer to avoid it if that’s OK. I can refer you to some well researched books that seriously question a lot of believed Islamic early history but I don’t think it will be useful at all, and will just make you angry.
        This is not what I want. In the end it is only speculation and if you already ‘know’ the truth then there is nothing to be gained by entertaining it.

        Now onto the reform question.

        There are many Muslims worldwide who believe in reform. In fact very few live by strict sharia guidelines.
        As you indicate, slavery has already been effectively abandoned. I don’t think this has to be regarded as a reform. You can regard it as a clarification. There are arguments against slavery in the teachings. All that has to be done is for people to accept that it wasn’t really correct, previous generations were misguided. By what we know now, they (understandably perhaps) came to incorrect conclusions.

        I think FGM is another good example. There are all sorts of arguments (and indeed fatwas) for and against this practice. We do not just have to accept it because it WAS regarded (by all 4 major sunni schools) as recommended.
        Many Muslims fight against this practice and campaign to get it removed.
        Some others deny it is has anything to do with Islam (Reza Aslan-grr).
        I think only the first way of doing things has value. Denying things will not ever help.

        This is not a new thing in Islam. Re-interpretation has happened throughout Islam’s history.

        Can I ask you to consider the old Mu’tazalite school of Islamic thought that prevailed during (and fostered) the Islamic golden age.

        ‘The Mu’tazilites asserted the primacy of reason, and that one’s first duty is to engage in reason and, through it, come to know God. They also thought it their duty to understand revelation in a way that comported with reason, so that if something in the Koran seemed inconsistent with reason, it should not be read literally. It should therefore be taken as metaphor or analogy.’

        Now another school of thought arose that challenged that (and forever destroyed the golden age).

        ‘Not all of this went over well with the more traditional Muslims. Out of this opposition arose another school of theology that came to be known as the Ash’arites, after its founder al-Ash’ari. They denied, point by point, everything the Mu’tazalites said. They claimed God isn’t reason but pure will and power. He can do anything He wants—He’s not restrained or constrained by anything, including His own word. There is no way one can know what is good or evil through reason, but only through revelation.
        Al-Ghazali, the great Ash’arite theologian, said that “no obligations flow from reason, but from the Sharia.’

        Now the Ash’arite view prevailed and is what we are stuck with now. I would say that Islam could be a benefit to humanity under the Mu’tazalite thinking, and has been a burden under the Ash’arite. Muslims achieved more than any others under the Mu’tazalite, and have achieved less than any others under the Ash’arite.
        I know this is probably a bit too harsh but I hope that you see what I mean, and that it is not just my secular viewpoint that questions the status quo. Many Muslims throughout history have also done this.

        I will finish with a quote from Fethullah Gülen about Islam in a democratic society.

        ‘95% of Islamic principles are permissible and practically feasible, and there is no problem with them. The remaining 5% are not worth fighting for.’

        In Peace

      • Thank you , you told me something that I never knew. I will come back with research on it.

      • Hi Derek,
        Lets see how you see things and how thing actually are.
        1) You talked about Islamic laws supporting Slavery. Well, before Islam it was all mess, no law any where on the face of earth for slaves. Muslims and Islam first set the tradition to set slaves free even Hazrat Umer(R.A) once said “A mother gives birth her child as a free human, who turns that child into slave”. During Islamic rule, freeing slaves was considered as one of the best deeds. So Islam regulated existing things rather, imposed something new. Now there are two things which non-muslim, and some times muslims also, mix with Islamic law. One is history,and in history yes indeed , there may be many things which may be against Islamic law, but the person doing that was not, for sure, the maker of Islamic law(human factor). Second thing is argument. Can you argue with the word of God? Thant’s why we do not argue with Quraan. That’s why schools of thought are not considered any thing when it comes to Quraan and Hadith, and that is the reason muslims do not teach their children about schools of thought. That’s why they are just called “schools of thought” only. Its another debate that weather you are convinced with the Quraan to be the word of God or not.
        2) Lets see how non-muslim world flourished in the absence of Islam. America built by blacks, black slaves, who brought them to america? Muslims under Islamic Law? 🙂 . Red army entered Berlin in WW2, raped almost every women they could found, most of the women were murdered , no women taken slave by a single man, many women raped to death. So again under Islamic law? Americans raped thousands of Vietnamis and Japanese women during wars, so was it under Islamic law? There are many many examples. We still donot call it christian terrorism or rape under Christian law, or rape under Secular law(if there any).
        3) What are the conditions of humans in west? Marriage is difficult and fornication is easy. Like you are free as animal for sex, but you are not willing to make a life long bond? Why ? because the western men consider women to be only tissue paper or a sex gadget? Thats the the reason population in west on decline, and sooner or later there will be no white race on the face of earth if that trend continued. I am not at all racist, because Islam does not permits me to be racist, but that is what very clear now.
        4) What is the ratio of single mother to single fathers in west? May be 50/1 , and that one unfortunate father may be one whose wife is dead. Because men in west donot want to bear the burden of a woman and family, and they are simply running away. Why ? because of Islamic law? We muslims never called that they are doing it because of secular law, because their deeds are not guided by religion for sure, infact absence of religion is the biggest factor. Yes we muslims do 2 or very rarely three marriages, but we also bear full expenses of our all family, wives and children, and we donot run away thats what Islamic teaches us.
        5) Yes we muslims do second or third marriage and we bear their responsibilities too. There are many muslims(and so are many non-muslims) who donot put any limit on women they are in marriage with. This is the beauty of Islamic law that it presents solutions for these extreme conditions too. After all sex like animals is no better then a marriage or slavery. Even I have heard thing like “how to effectively hit on a woman” from westerners. Why hitting on women? Do they worth just to be contacted for sex only? Why not marrying them and include them in your family with respect?
        6) Now how a secular system supports human to sustain human race?

        Muhammad Tahir Rana

      • Hi again Tahir,

        It has been a long time. I hope you have enjoyed good health. I’ll have a go at answering your points with my opinions. Obviously, as you’ve probably guessed from our earlier conversations there are some parts of Islam that I personally have problems with. I hope you are not too offended if I overstep the mark with any of my replies. I do not mean to offend, just provide a point of view.

        1/ Yes in Arabia laws were a mess. Not so much in the rest of the world. Before Islam even began the Romans had passed many laws around the good treatment of slaves and slavery was diminishing there. ‘Freed’ men were some of the most powerful in Rome at times. Of course others practiced slavery but Islam is the only mainstream religion that clearly sanctions slavery (and does so for all time). Muhammad remains the only great religious leader that kept slaves and enslaved people. All other mainstream religions (including even confucianism) include the ‘golden rule’ where you should treat others as you would like to be treated yourself. This is not the case for Islam, otherwise slavery could not be sanctioned. The simple scale of Islamic slavery (as outlined in this very article) dwarfs the rest of the world.
        You’ve hit the nail on the head of course when you talk of ‘arguing with the word of God’. The existence of God is a matter of personal belief. Which words and instructions are attributed to God are a matter of personal belief. I’m sure you are aware I could point to contradictory instructions in the Quran as well as the hadith. I don’t want to get too deep in looking at the texts. I’m just sure you can appreciate that for a non-believer the argument ‘because God said’ doesn’t count for much when the instruction goes against common sense or what seems most beneficial for humanity.

        2/ I’m not sure it’s true to say that black slaves ‘built’ America. They were mostly used in agriculture. Sure black people have been very important in making America what it is today as have many other races.
        Yes all types of people have carried out rapes, particularly during the horror of war. If people are treated with less humanity they tend to act with less humanity in my opinion. The difference is that these things are regarded as crimes and punished accordingly.
        When Muslim armies sacked cities (notably Byzantium) they were allowed 3 days to do what they liked to the population. This was religously sanctioned-that’s the difference.
        We don’t call it Christian rape or secular rape because it is not sanctioned. They are specifically against that sort of behaviour. When Anders Breivik committed his terrorism they did initially try to call it Christian terror. It wasn’t of course because his motivation was not religion. The reason people refer to Islamic terrorism is because the people that carry it out specifically say that it is motivated by Islam and that is the only reason for it. They even cite Islamic texts that endorse their actions.
        All sorts of people do terrible things at times for various reasons. Islam is the only religion that consistently crops up as one of those reasons.

        3/ I think you have the wrong idea about the West. Marriage is not difficult. People are more than willing to make a life bond but they are also free to not make a life bond if they don’t wish to at that time. We simply have more freedom.
        Men and women are generally equal partners in the West (that is not what I see in many Muslim relationships). Men certainly don’t see women as a sex gadget (well I’m sure some do but they are idiots). I could say that in parts of the Muslim world women are just treated as baby making pleasure machines. There have been fatwas that command that a wife must be always available for sex whenever her husband requires it. Even the Islamic female clothing rules are in place because men are not to be blamed for their desires.
        I read Hirsi Ali’s book and it is funny when she first went to the Netherlands. She had been told that dressing immodestly would lead to men going berserk and raping her. When she arrived in the Netherlands women just dressed naturally depending on how warm it was. And… nothing bad happened. This was one of the moments when she realised that everything she had been told was wrong. She had believed Islam to be the perfect recipe for society. She only need to compare a non-Islamic society with an open mind to see how wrong that was.
        In Sweden rape was extremely rare until the massive recent increase in the Muslim population. It is not so rare now.
        The reason the population growth is slowing (it is not yet in decline) is because it makes sense to have fewer children and give them richer lives. The earth has limited resources. To be honest the Muslim world would do better emulating the slower birth rate of the West. Most sociologists think that this will happen naturally and the human population will actually reach a peak towards the end of this century. Do you really think it’s better to have ten uneducated children in povery or two well educated children with all they could ever need?

        4/ There are of course more single mothers than single fathers. This is more of a historic thing as traditionally women were seen as the child carers and men the earners. It is also a natural thing as the caring desire is stronger in women than men. It is also changing and the number of single fathers is increasing as things change over time. Most people who split up the father still pays for the children financially so your idea that they just abandon them is wrong.
        Also I have to point out that there are many Muslim women here who (thanks to the ease of divorce in Islam) have been abandoned by their husbands. Muslims may be supposed to provide for all of their wives and children. That’s not what happens in a lot of cases here. The state pays for them. The husband seems happy so long as they are provided for. He doesn’t seem to think it is him that needs to do the providing.
        In the recent case of the three women who fled with their nine children to IS in Syria, the fares were paid by welfare benefits. When you total up all the benefits, housing, education, healthcare etc this group of people were probably costing £125,000+ a year, paid for by UK taxpayers. How is this the husbands providing for them?

        5/ We just view women differently. Here they are much more equal. There are also books for women on how to hit on/attract men. Respect doesn’t depend on sex or the lack of it. Women (and men) are respected for who they are and what they say and do. If Islam is so respectful of women then why can’t a wealthy women have more than one husband? Why can a Muslim man marry a non-Muslim woman but a Muslim woman can’t marry a non-Muslim man?
        I think it is because in Islam women are just baby producing machines to be jealously guarded. That’s not respect.

        6/ The human race somehow managed to sustain itself for hundreds of thousands of years before the religions we now have. So the secular system already has a far more impressive record of supporting the human race than any religion.

      • Hello Derek,
        Ok I have two questions.
        1) Do you really believe that all that universe is a result of some random incident? If a hand watch which is not so complex can not be a result of some incident how come this whole universe be? which is a million times more complex than a hand watch?
        2) Please let me know about the contradictions in Quraan, with verse and chapter number please so that I may see whats over there. Quraan says “there is no doubt in this book”. And if you are able to find a single contradiction then basically you are able to burst the myth of Quraan. But, I am sure there are no contradictions in Quraan. Consider it a challenge from my side :).

      • Hello again,
        I think you are still trying to convert me. I’m afraid I’m a lost cause!
        In answer to your questions.

        1/ The immense complexity of the universe is at least as much an argument against it having a ‘creator’ as it is for it having one. Why would a creator not make something simpler? There are a great many things that you just wouldn’t choose to make the way they are. A good example from a book by Dawkins is the tongue of the giraffe. It goes all over the place in the giraffes neck. You can see how over millions of years, numerous minor variations could lead to it being the way it is. Nobody would design it that way though.
        Evolutionary theory is becoming so precise now that we can actually find each individual minor (random is a clumsy word) change that led from what was to what is.
        I studied quantum mechanics as part of my degree and the universe is completely built on random chance even today. The more we discover about the universe the less it seems likely that a supreme being created it. The more educated people become, the less likely they are to believe an a god.
        Chaos theory describes the incredible variations we see today far more convincingly than the idea of a supreme being.
        Hawking summarised the latest results in theoretical cosmology by declaring ‘we no longer have need of god’.
        Einstein didn’t like quantum theory and declared that ‘God does not play dice’. He had to admit he was wrong in the end.
        The hand watch is a nice example. It is not as complex as nature and would not occur by random chance (well never say never, but its likelihood is so small as to be immeasurable). It was created (by a human) for a specific purpose (telling the time). If the universe was created surely we would have more things like hand watches and fewer things like asteroid belts.
        I think I’ve gone on a bit too much here without much direction, sorry about that.

        2/ Do you really not think there are contradictions in the Quran? There are bigger ones when you consider the hadith certainly, but Islamic scholars derived the doctrine of abrogation from the Quran (2:106) specifically because there are contradictions.

        I suppose the one I have most problem with is (2:256) the ‘no compulsion in religion’ verse.
        The Quran also talks of the punishment for being a non believer (eternal torment). Threatens anyone who leaves Islam with ‘greavous chastisement’ (16:106). Commands believers to fight non believers until religion is only for allah (8:39).
        Further the ‘no compulsion’ verse is directly contradicted by 3:83
        ‘So is it other than the religion of Allah they desire, while to Him have submitted [all] those within the heavens and earth, willingly OR BY COMPULSION, and to Him they will be returned?’

        While not specifically in the Quran it is widely accepted that apostates are to be punished (or killed) based on hadiths. Also that non muslims cannot marry muslim women (that’s compulsion if you happen to fall for one).
        Muslim nations even got the wording of the universal declaration of human rights changed to take out the words of the right to leave a religion. That is compulsion pure and simple.
        A good discussion of the technicalities of compulsion in Islam can be found here:

        There are of course other contradictions. Any internet search will give plenty of examples. Some for starters

      • Dear Derek,
        Here are answers to your points. Really I was expecting some concrete 100 to 200 points, but you really disappointed me 🙂
        Firstly I will confess that my English speaking/writing skills are not to standard, as I am not a native English speaker and my English learning has never been very good, alas.

        2) Does abrogation mean contradiction? I think not. There are three kinds of abrogation/cancellations of Quraanic Ayats, and which are those ? its your task now to go and search. If you are unable to find then come back I will help you. Its like class assignment :).

        (about ayat 2:256 ) This verse was revealed after migration to Madinah. Before migration few young people from Madinah accepted Christianity and Judaism. After Migration of Messenger of Allah(S.W) to Madinah, the elders of those young people accepted Islam , and try to push these young people to accept Islam, so these verses were revealed, that there is no compulsion in Islam about acceptance, or in other words no non-muslims should be pushed to accept Islam

        (about ayat 16:106) I will encourage you read until 16:108. Once you accept Islam , you are under Islamic circle and Islamic law, and you will abide by the rules of the country you live in and Islamic laws. If these two laws contradict then find some solution near the boundaries of these laws, if even this is impossible , then leave that country. So once you are under Islamic jurisdiction you have to abide some rules/laws also, and one of them is that you must not leave Islam. But this is compulsion for muslims only, and ayat 2:256 is for non muslims. Here I will encourage you to please pay attention on the circumstances in which verses were revealed.

        (about ayat 3:83) This is the beauty of Islam, that Allah sent a man to tell people what is right and what is wrong, by just words, not by sword. If Allah wanted to push people , Allah would have sent a Jinn or something that might had people to accept Islam by force. Now , it may be noted that, some time people even knowing that it is truth do not accept what is truth. Here in this verse , Allah is talking about everything except human beings, as there is no compulsion on humans to accept Islam by force, but this rule is only for humans, not for “everything except humans” like angels, trees, animals etc.
        (All above verses have different context , in 2:256 , it is said donot push non muslims (humans)to accept Islam and they have to accept it by their own free will after reading searching observing the world around, in 16:106 it is said to abide by the laws of Islam, and in 3:83 it is said that every thing except humans is pushed to accept what is truth).

        (about ayat 8:39) Here I will strongly recommend you to read about the circumstances in which this verse was revealed and please read it from 8:36, from where this matter starts that whom to fight(again background reading is strongly recommended). Here I will present a little context for this verse. First major war of Islam was “war of Badar”. Non-believers from Makkah were preparing for war against Messenger of Allah(S.W) and his companions and finally (or some how) both armies met in Badar valley. After war these verses were revealed. In this verse, Allah is pointing towards conflicts like that, and it should not be taken as first order “order”, it is a conditional rule, and that says when it comes to situations like that, do that. Consider it a war time guide line.

        (about muslim women canot marry non-muslim) Yes, because children will most likely to adopt religion of their father. Here it may be noted that muslim man if it is needed only allowed to marry Jewish or Christian women(not hindu , not budhist etc).

        Come on Derek, who am I to convert you to Islam? It is something given by Allah. Its a blessing from Allah.

      • Thanks for taking the time to reply Tahir, I appreciate the time you’ve spent but I think we have reached clear points that we are just going to have to disagree on.

        Regarding abrogation. Of course it doesn’t mean contradiction. It is a way of resolving contradictions. If the Qur’an did not contradict itself then there would be no need for abrogation.
        Alcohol is a good example. It starts off allowed (heaven even contains rivers of wines), then it’s allowed but people mustn’t pray drunk, then it’s forbidden.
        I’ve heard various explanations about how this is not really a contradiction. I’m sorry but they are sheer sophistry. It is a contradiction, and there are many in the Qur’an. Look up a list of all the possible abrogations in the Qur’an, every one of these is a clear example of a contradiction in it. I’m not judging it for having contradictions, but to say there aren’t any is simply untrue.
        My trusty website (it’s bit conservative but there you go) talks about three types of abrogation. Every one is as a result of a contradiction (sometimes involving the hadith as well).

        You explanations refer consistently to the conditions of the time of revelation. I’m not sure how relevant this is. The instructions in the Qur’an are (according to the Qur’an itself) supposed to be perfectly clear, and valid for all time. You may be guided by the context of the time of revelation, many Muslims take them literally, and that is one of the reasons why Islam has always caused so many problems in the world.

        You have ignored my link to islamqa where an Islamic scholar clearly states that non Muslims can be forced to Islam. (other scholars say people of the book are protected from this – although even they have to ‘submit’ which is really another form of compulsion – but other peoples are not protected). This certainly happened throughout Islamic history and continues today. While I applaud your interpretation, it is far from the only one and cannot really be definitively regarded as correct.
        You do seem content that people are compelled to not leave Islam. This is in contradiction to basic human rights. Many Muslims would have joined the faith as children before they knew anything about it. Many more join Islam without knowing the full facts about it. I read about a Somalian woman recently who had always been a Muslim but hadn’t read the Qur’an. She read it and was appalled by what it contains and decided to leave Islam. According to you she should be killed. That is unacceptable and if your religion was worthwhile then it would not need to force people to stay within it.

        You have glossed over the reason that the Meccans were preparing for war. it was because the Muslims had raided their caravans, and killed their people.
        While limiting this verse (and those like it) to the context of the time is a nice idea, I need to remind you that within a couple of centuries of these purported events Muslim armies had followed these instructions (not apparently limited by the context) and conquered vast swathes of the Middle East and North Africa, attacking on the flimsiest excuses (where there were any at all) and slaughtering anyone who stood in their way.
        I’m afraid the hundreds of millions of dead and enslaved at the hand of marauding Muslims would not feel any happier that these Muslims weren’t getting the context of their instruction right in your opinion.

        It’s obvious WHY Muslim women are not allowed to marry non Muslims. It’s just wrong by basic standards of humanity. You would treat your women as protected breeding stock rather than human beings.

        Sorry if I’m being harsh or offensive. Peace.

  26. Awesome blog you have here but I was wondering if you knew of any community forums that cover the same topics discussed in this article?
    I’d really like to be a part of community where I can get responses from other experienced people that share
    the same interest. If you have any recommendations, please let
    me know. Appreciate it!

  27. This is a very intriguing article. This is the total opposite of what I was taught in school. I live in a Muslim country so I have studied a little about the history if Islam. But not once had the books touched on slavery. In fact, it is stated that women and children prisoners were not to be harmed and kept as prisoners or slaves. Male prisoners are also to be released after teaching children to read. However, scouring the internet for information has proved this incorrect, as there are undeniably many cases of slavery, torture and rape.

    This is indeed troubling. For if all this is true, that means the books we read were written based on lies. Because if Islam really did not condone slavery, then why did slavery by Muslims occur in a much greater scale then other Western countries? I’m not too sure about who and what source to trust anymore.

    • It is very admirable that you are prepared to consider this in this way. Too many Muslims would rather deny history than face it. The so called scholars are particularly bad at this and mislead other people.
      All races and creeds have some bad deeds in their past, we cannot change it. It is what we do now that matters.

      Your attitude gives me hope for the future.

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  31. I feel so sad for those baby girls that were molested by Mohammed and his band of paedophiles and those that are still being molested by his followers. I just can’t help but wonder what pleasure a full grown man can find in the undeveloped breasts of a small girl who is even yet to hit puberty. You can see the level of brainwashing when you read the response of people like Tahir who see nothing wrong in molesting an underaged girl. Giving silly excuse that it’s better to defile an underaged girl and then marry her than just sleeping with her and not marrying her is crass and frankly animalistic. why not protect her dignity and allow her to realise her potentials fully as a human being and not some chattel to your so-called ”holy” prophet. Compare the life of Jesus with that of Mohammed and see the infinite difference. The birth of Mohammed according to my opinion is a great disservice to humanity. Now grown up Muslim men have the excuse they want to indulge themselves in paedophilia. Sleeping with girls the age of their grand-daughters. Afterall if Mohammed did it then it must be right! So sad for those poor girls who have their lives ruined by sexual predators even before they can decide on their own to live a decent life.

    • You dont feel any thing for the girls molested by men like you today, you dont even feel anything for the women who are pushed into prostitution in west or other part of this world….. what a level of sensitivity you have. Really its an honor to read the words from you.

      • You are not really answering John’s points. You are accusing him of being a child molester and saying he has no feelings for women being forced into prostitution. I can’t see the grounds for that comment. John sounds to have empathy for others and that seems to be at the core of this debate. There has been controversy here in the UK over the case of over 1,400 school age girls being sexually abused on a commercial scale by Muslim men in Rotherham and many similar cases elsewhere.They are seen as ‘fair game’ by their abusers and Islamic tradition seems to support their actions. The taxi drivers who ferried them around went on strike because the local Council decided to insist on CCTV being installed in taxicabs. Which seems like a case of denial. Are you being sarcastic at the end?

  32. I usually avoid sites like this as it’s often the case that nothing is achieved apart from raised tempers and the exposure of the ignorant views of a sadly ill-informed and prejudiced mindset. We owe it to ourselves and others to be open-minded and keen seekers of the truth.

    It’s easy to settle back with a few ideas picked up from suspect sources and then fire scorn at those who disagree. In conversation with a Muslim lady recently I suggested that we are free to believe whatever we wish (shocked surprise) even fairies! (more shock). What one can’t do is kill someone for not believing in fairies – or whatever else one chooses (silence).

    Tahir has found a platform that tolerates him by and large and those who respond show remarkable patience with his views. His views may seem fair and true to him but for me they expose the flaws in his perspective. Thank you for unintentionally eliminating the doubts I may have had about the nature of Islam’s core values. Well done this site! Peace be with you, now and for always.

    • Perhaps the greatest mystery is why do people take religion so seriously? It’s very like theatre with its scripts and ritual behaviours.

    • Many groups practised slavery in the past but it’s not evidenced in all cultures. As has been said before the difference with Islam is that it is still seen as acceptable. Whereas most of the world now seems to manage without it.

  33. I am profoundly upset by this post. But it begs the question, what perpetuated this system for so long in these territories?

      • Take islam serious, dont take muslims serious, because most of us are clowns, thats why we are what we are. You are right upto an extent.

      • So am I right in thinking that you never chose to become a Muslim and if you had been born into a different culture and family you would have been ‘born’ something else?

      • I suppose the point is that initially you had no choice in being a Muslim. You could and did choose a different strand of Islam but what would happen if you were to choose a different religion entirely? That is my question.

      • Why will I do that ever? Like why will I ever adopt any other religion? I never find any glitch or fault in Islam.

      • We are all able to change our opinions if we wish. Hypocrisy, contradictions, irrationality and double standards are the usual weak points of religions. But you dodged the question rather than answering it. “I will give you answer for every question, and as many questions as you want to ask. I am never tired of answering (If I am not busy somewhere :))”

      • What is it you want to hear sir? Say it by your kind self please. If answer is not according to your innocent wishes then it doesnt mean it is dodging.
        If you study Islam, others religions will seem fake. Dont believe me ? go for it. Start from studying Quraan, only then you will know why the rate of conversion of muslims to other religions is very low. I think now I am clear.

      • I’ll repeat the question again. What would happen if you were to choose a different religion entirely? That is my question.

      • and I will repeat my answer that I never find any religion more true than Islam.
        Secondly what you want me to say is what you already know. So donot insist on that please.

      • I’m sure you know the answer really.

        Many people have left Islam. In most cases their lives are in danger and they are disowned by their former family and friends.

        The then head of the Muslim brotherhood summed it up clearly
        “If they had gotten rid of the punishment for apostasy, Islam would not exist today.” Yusuf al-Qaradawi

        So one of the leading scholars of today believes that the appeal of Islam is such that people will only stay under sentence of death.

        Further discussion here

      • Hi Derek, thank you for your reply. I had heard that there was a death penalty in some countries for leaving Islam or apostasy. I’m not sure what would happen in Tahir’s case as I don’t know where he lives. I’m sure/hoping it doesn’t apply in every country. I thought he would be able to tell me his position. It seems not. The head of the Muslim Brotherhood you quoted seems perfectly aware of the value of this rule in maintaining the faith of followers. To my mind it’s outrageous that followers of Islam should live under this threat but it explains a lot of the psychological fall-out that surrounds this philosophy and its adherents.

      • Hi Derek, I’ve had a look at the link you offered and it really is worse than I thought. Thanks again.

      • May be I got your point. So here is my own story.
        I was born into a muslim ,sect following family(Sunni-Deobandi). When I become able to read and understand Islamic teachings, after a few researchs I became sunni-Wahabi. But on my journey towards truth and with passage of time I totally become convinced by the idea that sects are sects, they are not true teaching. Sects are invented by people, to sell their small commodities , which with passage of time become sect-incorporations. The same is true for Christianity with 3 main sects and Judaism with 73 main sects. So, in last I follow Islam not any single sect(of Islam).
        Taunting at Islam for slavery laws(which are not any more practiced) is same as taunting at police department for keeping pistols and guns. Although weapons are bad things, but they are very necessary to control beast hidden in humans. This is the beauty of Islamic laws that Islam presents solutions for every extreme and normal condition.

        Donot hesitate to replay with what ever comes into your mind. I will give you answer for every question , and as many questions as you want to ask. I am never tired of answering(If I am not busy somewhere :))

    • Hi Peter, there’s an interesting book called ‘Saharasia’ which links the development of patriarchal religion and its war making culture to the desertification of the Sahara and the Middle East around 4000 years BC. It’s available through Amazon but there are a few excerpts and updates on James DeMeo’s webpage. That may answer your question. Good Luck!

  34. 1. ??????????? why islam only ? christians, jews etc all had slaves in the beginning.. why targeting one religion..

    2. there are rules of slavery which are not possible in normal condition (like war capturing etc), where slaves are better than prisoners in jail

    3. yes, molesting, rapes etc has increased and slavery is vanished, still we talk this topic, just to win or feel better 🙂


    • Many groups practised slavery in the past but it’s not evidenced in all cultures. As has been said before the difference with Islam is that it is still seen as acceptable. Whereas most of the world now seems to manage without it. Whether slavery is better than jail probably depends on the treatment one experiences in either condition. I wouldn’t wish to own another human being and I would avoid anyone who would want to do so.

  35. Slavery existed in the past in most communities, and existed before Islam was established in the middle east. The laws of Islam are such that over time it was inevitable for slaves to be freed and society to be equal, hence there were many slaves freed during the expansion of Islam.

    I think what makes the issue more cloudy is that of POW, which there were many, and some commentators seem to struggle to differentiate a POW and a slave. Islam is against slavery, and legislates effectively, in war however, prisoners are inevitable.

    • Most of what you say is completely untrue.
      Slavery did exist in many societies certainly. The laws of Islam are NOT such that slaves are inevitably freed (otherwise slavery wouldn’t have still been practiced in Saudi Arabia in 1962). There were indeed many slaves freed under Islam, there were always many more enslaved to take their place though. Slavery would continue today throughout the Muslim world if the Western powers had not insisted it stop. It most certainly was not Islam that stopped it. In fact many Muslim countries still have slavery practiced unofficially.

      POW’s do not ‘cloud’ the issue at all. There is no reason that a POW should be enslaved. Muslim armies often went to war for no other reason than to GAIN slaves. They were not an incidental side issue, they were the whole point. Most slaves were not the POW’s-they were more usually slaughtered as per Muhammad’s example of the Banu Qurayza. The slaves tended to be the non combatants that the victorious Muslims rounded up.

      “Slavery is a part of Islam…(those who argue that slavery is abolished are) ignorant, not scholars. They are merely writers. Whoever says such things is an infidel.”
      Sheikh Al Fawzan

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